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Future of Trek Discussion of future Trek projects.

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Old October 10 2008, 08:14 PM   #1
RobertScorpio
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cable tv TREK

I think any new TREK TV-SHOW should be made on one of the cable nets, like HBO. HBO has been cleaning up the Emmy Awards for many years. I'd like to see a real mature STAR TREK TV series that could push the limits in terms of action, story, and yes, even sexual content. Star Trek needs to grow up, and I think a quality made show on HBO is the best bet for that happening...

Rob
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Old October 10 2008, 10:15 PM   #2
Haytil
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Re: cable tv TREK

RobertScorpio wrote: View Post
I'd like to see a real mature STAR TREK TV series that could push the limits in terms of action, story, and yes, even sexual content. Star Trek needs to grow up, and I think a quality made show on HBO is the best bet for that happening...
SEXUAL CONTENT! YES!

Nothing says "mature" and "grown up" more than sexual content!
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Old October 11 2008, 01:35 AM   #3
RobertScorpio
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Re: cable tv TREK

Haytil wrote: View Post
RobertScorpio wrote: View Post
I'd like to see a real mature STAR TREK TV series that could push the limits in terms of action, story, and yes, even sexual content. Star Trek needs to grow up, and I think a quality made show on HBO is the best bet for that happening...
SEXUAL CONTENT! YES!

Nothing says "mature" and "grown up" more than sexual content!
Well!..there's one fan already. SEX does sell!!

Rob
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Old October 13 2008, 12:48 AM   #4
C.E. Evans
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Re: cable tv TREK

Boob Trek!
"...to boldly go where no bra has gone before!"
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Old October 13 2008, 02:11 AM   #5
RobertScorpio
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Re: cable tv TREK

C.E. Evans wrote: View Post
Boob Trek!
"...to boldly go where no bra has gone before!"
To hell with that..I say, BEAVER TREK!!!

Rob
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Old October 13 2008, 06:07 AM   #6
cardinal biggles
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Re: cable tv TREK

To hell with both of those. Trek needs to move away from eye candy, T&A, catsuits, and giggle-inducing decon gel rubdowns and nekkid Vulcan neuro-pressure treatments. That's not to say the human form is not attractive, nor is it to say that the characters shouldn't get in relationships with each other and have sex, but could they at least try and aim a bit higher than sending a bunch of 15-year-old fanboys scrambling for their jizz-rags?
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Old October 13 2008, 12:50 PM   #7
USS KG5
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Re: cable tv TREK

cardinal biggles wrote: View Post
To hell with both of those. Trek needs to move away from eye candy, T&A, catsuits, and giggle-inducing decon gel rubdowns and nekkid Vulcan neuro-pressure treatments.
Awwww!

That's not to say the human form is not attractive, nor is it to say that the characters shouldn't get in relationships with each other and have sex, but could they at least try and aim a bit higher than sending a bunch of 15-year-old fanboys scrambling for their jizz-rags?
Well hopefully they can appeal to an older more discerning audience and still feature attractive women, retaining both audiences.
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Old October 13 2008, 03:53 PM   #8
RobertScorpio
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Re: cable tv TREK

cardinal biggles wrote: View Post
To hell with both of those. Trek needs to move away from eye candy, T&A, catsuits, and giggle-inducing decon gel rubdowns and nekkid Vulcan neuro-pressure treatments. That's not to say the human form is not attractive, nor is it to say that the characters shouldn't get in relationships with each other and have sex, but could they at least try and aim a bit higher than sending a bunch of 15-year-old fanboys scrambling for their jizz-rags?
Sorry..not sure what universe you live in, but SEX SALES. And since sex is something that most 'everyday' people do, then showing the characters getting out of bed, naked, or flirting..or just the normal human contact would, in my opinion, be far more realistic, and accessable, to fans who think Trek is aimed at...Dorky 15 year olds...

Its time for Star Trek to GROW UP..

Rob
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Old October 13 2008, 04:14 PM   #9
C.E. Evans
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Re: cable tv TREK

cardinal biggles wrote: View Post
To hell with both of those. Trek needs to move away from eye candy, T&A, catsuits, and giggle-inducing decon gel rubdowns and nekkid Vulcan neuro-pressure treatments. That's not to say the human form is not attractive, nor is it to say that the characters shouldn't get in relationships with each other and have sex, but could they at least try and aim a bit higher than sending a bunch of 15-year-old fanboys scrambling for their jizz-rags?
Whoa, dial it back a bit. It cuts both ways--overreaction against anything sexy can make one look immature as well.

There's nothing remotely wrong with making Trek sexier--I think TOS still showed more skin comparatively than any of its spinoffs. Eye candy--namely putting Starfleet women in micro miniskirts and green-haired alien chicks in metal bras--is what helped sell TOS. The old adage that sex sells may be a cliche now, but it's also a universal truth. Even Kirk was something of eye candy for female viewers since it seemed he could never go planetside without ripping his shirt at times. TNG did away with miniskirts after its first few episodes, but it was the originator of the catsuits because the female uniforms were noticeably tighter and tended to emphasize the bustline.

The thing is, however, is that we live in a more politically correct and more informed age and people are very quick to pick up when something is being done deliberately--and rather badly. In the case of Seven of Nine and T'Pol, part of the problem was was that they were two characters that theoretically should have been the least sexiest members of their respective crews, and yet they were inexplicably paraded around in sexy costumes that was contradictory to their nature and culture (one might expect a Klingon female in something tight-fitting and revealing, but a Vulcan female? A traumatized former female Borg?). Fans generally saw through the producers' plan to make Seven and T'Pol sex objects as well as the real reason behind decon gel in ENT.

Personally, I definitely think Trek can definitely stand to be sexier, but I don't believe it needs to be R-rated or done in a way that it becomes a major distraction. Once again, I think TOS did it right, and I wouldn't mind a return to something like that...
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Old October 13 2008, 05:31 PM   #10
RobertScorpio
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Re: cable tv TREK

The sex would have to be more mature...but CSI, 24, LOST, HEROES have all done this tastefully while trying to tell a good story. I think TREK should be able to work it in as they do...and there is nothing wrong with eye candy. Though, with trek, you're going to get the obvious fan sects screaming for same/sex scenes between women, and more importantly, men. That is where the issue gets, pardon the pun, sticky.

Rob
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Old October 13 2008, 08:08 PM   #11
cardinal biggles
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Re: cable tv TREK

Where did I say "no sex," and where did I say I was ignorant of the fact that sex sells? Now who's overreacting? I said handle it with maturity. As much as people want to rag on TOS for the miniskirts and the scantily clad alien princesses and Kirk getting it on, TOS really was far more mature than some of its successors in terms of sex and how it presented sex to the audience of the time. If Trek wants to be a serious show taken seriously by adults, knock it off with the women in catsuits and decon gel. You don't see that sort of shit on C.S.I., E.R., 24, Lost, and the rest.

Or, to frame it in terms of Rob's original post, people don't watch The Sopranos, Dexter, Oz, The Wire, or any of the other shows because they had profanity, sex, and violence. They watched them because the shows were intelligently written, with solid groups of actors playing compelling characters. That's the sign of a good show, when the writing is good enough that you can have an unlikeable, perhaps even immoral lead character like Tony Soprano or Dexter Morgan or Al Swearengen, and people like him anyway. Not saying Trek needs a lead character like that, but the writing has to be a lot better than it was on Voyager and Enterprise if they want to compete in today's entertainment marketplace.
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Old October 13 2008, 10:46 PM   #12
C.E. Evans
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Re: cable tv TREK

cardinal biggles wrote: View Post
Where did I say "no sex," and where did I say I was ignorant of the fact that sex sells? Now who's overreacting? I said handle it with maturity. As much as people want to rag on TOS for the miniskirts and the scantily clad alien princesses and Kirk getting it on, TOS really was far more mature than some of its successors in terms of sex and how it presented sex to the audience of the time. If Trek wants to be a serious show taken seriously by adults, knock it off with the women in catsuits and decon gel. You don't see that sort of shit on C.S.I., E.R., 24, Lost, and the rest.
Calm down, no need to overreact or anything...


Aside from a few off-color jokes, nobody here has seriously said that Trek should become become Star Porky's: The Next Generation or anything like that (or at least, not yet, anyway). Indeed, the general consensus is that Trek should approach certain subjects with more sophistication that may have been lacking in more recent productions. Now how far Trek should go with that will always be a matter of debate--some will say more, some will say less--but Trek can be a well-written series that can broach serious adult themes without being so hamfisted or sophomoric about it.

And the only reason why you don't see catsuits on CSI, ER, 24, Lost and the rest is that they ain't got Federation starships in 'em...
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Old October 14 2008, 06:50 PM   #13
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Re: cable tv TREK

Peggy Olson: Sex sells.
Don Draper: Says who? Just so you know, the people who talk that way think that monkeys can do this. They take all this monkey crap and stick it in a briefcase, completely unaware that their success depends on something more than shoeshine.

Don Draper: You are the product. You feeling something. That's what sells. Not them. Not sex. They can't do what we do and they hate us for it.

Anyways, Trek might be a good fit for the new Viacom network... but they need to focus on finding some talent to put behind the lens before they worry about putting someone's... errr... 'talents' in front of the lens.
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Old October 15 2008, 12:00 AM   #14
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Re: cable tv TREK

cardinal biggles wrote: View Post
To hell with both of those. Trek needs to move away from eye candy, T&A, catsuits, and giggle-inducing decon gel rubdowns and nekkid Vulcan neuro-pressure treatments. That's not to say the human form is not attractive, nor is it to say that the characters shouldn't get in relationships with each other and have sex, but could they at least try and aim a bit higher than sending a bunch of 15-year-old fanboys scrambling for their jizz-rags?
I agree wholeheartedly.
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Old October 18 2008, 01:46 AM   #15
Temis the Vorta
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Re: cable tv TREK

Star Trek is good at many things, but sex does NOT immediately spring to mind. Do we really want the dreaded Romance of the Week format, but with more skin, in lieu of the kinds of episodes we actually like?

Think about the best episodes of Star Trek - they have as little to do with sex as possible and in the few cases where they do (Amok Time), a sex scene would add nothing (unless it's K/S, but we shouldn't go there).

I'd be happy to go the other way and mandate that sex be eradicated from Star Trek altogether, so we can get more of the good stuff. If we want sexy Trek, that's what fanfic is for (not to mention certain cleverly edited, if disturbing, YouTube videos). We don't need to waste screentime on Sex Trek when there's a whole Internet full of it.
In the case of Seven of Nine and T'Pol, part of the problem was was that they were two characters that theoretically should have been the least sexiest members of their respective crews, and yet they were inexplicably paraded around in sexy costumes that was contradictory to their nature and culture
Yeah that's a different issue - that's stupidity, and stupidity is never sexy, it's just annoying. It's possible to combine sci fi and sex in a non-stupid way, not just in fanfic/YouTube but occasionally on a show like Farscape. But the sensibilities of that show were very un-Trekkian and I don't think it would make any sense to try to change Star Trek to fit the Farscape way of doing things. It would be much preferable to have another Farscape-style series back on TV that has nothing to do with Star Trek.

Or, to frame it in terms of Rob's original post, people don't watch The Sopranos, Dexter, Oz, The Wire, or any of the other shows because they had profanity, sex, and violence.
I've noticed Dexter in particular has sex scenes only when the plotline requires them, and to the degree of explicitness that the plotline requires. That is the complete opposite of the catsuit approach, where the very characters who'd be least likely to dress in a catsuit get shoved into them. It's an issue of integrity. I have far more respect for Dexter's extremely explicit sex scenes and none at all for Barbie of Borg's attire.

Anyways, Trek might be a good fit for the new Viacom network... but they need to focus on finding some talent to put behind the lens before they worry about putting someone's... errr... 'talents' in front of the lens.
With all the problems Star Trek has, sex is the least of it. Let's concentrate on getting the basics right first. (And I'm skeptical that sex will ever be a good fit for Star Trek. The franchise will always need to have a certain puritanism about it, just to maintain its traditional tone. Let other shows be Farscape redux.)

Last edited by Temis the Vorta; October 18 2008 at 01:59 AM. Reason: yakking about Dexter again geeze am I obsessed or what?
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