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Go Back   The Trek BBS > Star Trek Movies > Star Trek Movies XI+

Star Trek Movies XI+ Discuss J.J. Abrams' rebooted Star Trek here.

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Old August 12 2008, 07:42 PM   #16
Nedersong
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Re: Uniform Differences

Obsesses over the tinyest details much?

OY!
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Old August 12 2008, 07:53 PM   #17
Admiral Buzzkill
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Re: Uniform Differences

SonicRanger wrote: View Post
As TrekMovie’s closer look at the new poster reveals (above), the colored uniform blouses have small ‘delta shield’ emblems woven into the fabric (this is most apparent on Saldana’s)
That just means: "Hey, we looked at the poster and saw a delta pattern.".
Nope, that's not what it means. Not at all. But not everything people know can be always be said.
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Old August 12 2008, 07:59 PM   #18
ancient
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Re: Uniform Differences

Well, I for one will be stoked to see the TOS uniforms on the big screen, tiny pattern or no.
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Old August 12 2008, 08:25 PM   #19
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Re: Uniform Differences

I wonder how hard the fabric is to rip? And will Kirk wear the undershirt?
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Old August 12 2008, 08:39 PM   #20
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Re: Uniform Differences

ManOnTheWave wrote: View Post
While I think the uniforms being made of little chevrons is Superman Returns lame, it's not that far a stretch. And it doesn't look as stupid as having a camo pattern made up of the GIJoe logo. The approach they seem to be taking with TOS unis is just layered athletic wear like Nike, Adidas, or Under Armor. The chevron is also a minor detail you'll barely see onscreen.
Why would it be lame?
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Old August 12 2008, 08:54 PM   #21
Cary L. Brown
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Re: Uniform Differences

SonicRanger wrote: View Post
Squiggyfm wrote: View Post
What would it take to convince you, more pictures?
Of course a photo that hasn't been artistically altered would be convincing. It just seems clear that the delta shield has been a recurring theme for the film's promotion -- these posters remind us of that. The subtle delta shield pattern, as seen in this posters, could be just an "easter egg" of sorts -- a little detail for us to catch, just like the delta reflected in their eyes. The graphic designers might also have decided that the uniforms needed some sort of texture when printed in monochrome on large posters. At this point, the delta pattern could just be an artistic addition.
It does seem like, well... like a rather extravagant expense for something that the audience really couldn't give a flying @#$* about.

It's really not all that common for a film production to commission their own fabric production facility with their own custom weaving mechanics. You can do this with molding, or embossing, easily enough... but not with fabric weaving.

SO...

1) Maybe they spend half of the movie's budget setting up a specialized textile manufacturing facility?

2) Maybe they found a fabric already in production which has a "delta-shield-like" element in the weave already?

3) Maybe the overshirts aren't made from any fabric in the sense we think of (ie, they're molded plastic)?

4) Maybe the thing is simply photoshopped in, as is being proposed.

I find #1 to be INCREDIBLY UNLIKELY. And #3 brings in a whole new set of problems to be dealth with (fabric is easy to work with and looks good... other materials, less o).

So, for me, I tend to think that it's either #2, or #4. And if it's #2, that's just a case of dumb luck... of someone having stumbled upon this fabric.
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Old August 12 2008, 09:04 PM   #22
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Re: Uniform Differences



It was done for "Spider-Man." It was done for "Superman Returns." And it was done for Abrams' "Star Trek."
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Old August 12 2008, 09:11 PM   #23
Jon1701
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Re: Uniform Differences

I suppose the only thing you could say for Spiderman, Superman et all is that they only had to make one outfit (although they probably made plenty of spares) as opposed the the hundreds they made this time out. I've no idea the costs involved in creating a delta shield-esqe fabric off the shelf. I assume its a relatively simple process but I honestly have no idea.

I think we need a fabric expert. Do we have a fabric expert on the board? There's never a fabric expert when you need one.

I can't believe I'm discussing fabric.
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Old August 12 2008, 09:19 PM   #24
Admiral Buzzkill
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Re: Uniform Differences

The likelihood of it is academic. The costumes are printed with the Starfleet chevron.
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Old August 12 2008, 09:24 PM   #25
Cary L. Brown
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Re: Uniform Differences

Starship Polaris wrote: View Post


It was done for "Spider-Man." It was done for "Superman Returns." And it was done for Abrams' "Star Trek."
No, neither of the above created custom woven fabrics, and I'd be shocked if Abrams did it either.

Both Spiderman and SR had RUBBER SUITS. Which, if you notice, I DID mention. But since I sincerely doubt that the clothes our stars will be wearing on-screen will be molded rubber (complete with "bat-nipples?") I doubt that this is relevant...

Do you have reason to believe that the costumes being worn in this film will have that?

Oh, and as for "Spiderman," I didn't notice any "little spider" in the weave of any fabric. I noticed big, embossed rubber stripes on it, but that's hardly the same thing. So we're limited to "Superman Returns." Which was a rubber muscle-suit, wasn't it?
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Old August 12 2008, 09:33 PM   #26
ManOnTheWave
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Re: Uniform Differences

http://www.usatoday.com/life/movies/...uper-man_x.htm

This article with the SR costume designer doesn't say anything about rubber suits, but does say they relied on Routh to fill out the suit with his body. It was material with sculpted rubber accents.

"This first look at Superman Returns— due in theaters in June 2006 — shows that the skin-tight costume stretches over only the actor's muscles and frame, without the augmented armored pecs or abs of recent movie superheroes...."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spider-Man_2


Spider Man had fake muscles, but they were still under cloth.
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Last edited by ManOnTheWave; August 12 2008 at 09:59 PM.
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Old August 12 2008, 09:33 PM   #27
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Re: Uniform Differences

Starship Polaris wrote: View Post
The likelihood of it is academic. The costumes are printed with the Starfleet chevron.
Oh, I agree completely.

The costumes are clearly printed with the chevron. Having said that, I would have thought something like that would have been cost prohibative, but the budget is...what, $120-150 million? You could buy a decent factory in india or china for that...

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Old August 12 2008, 09:34 PM   #28
Cary L. Brown
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Re: Uniform Differences

jon1701 wrote: View Post
I suppose the only thing you could say for Spiderman, Superman et all is that they only had to make one outfit (although they probably made plenty of spares) as opposed the the hundreds they made this time out. I've no idea the costs involved in creating a delta shield-esqe fabric off the shelf. I assume its a relatively simple process but I honestly have no idea.

I think we need a fabric expert. Do we have a fabric expert on the board? There's never a fabric expert when you need one.

I can't believe I'm discussing fabric.
In order to create a new weave, you have to createa new weaving process and, in most cases, create new weaving machinery to produce it. And it's not a trivial task to come up with a weaving pattern.

I've never dealt with this for clothing purposes, but I've dealt with composites using woven fabric meshes integrated into them. In these cases, it's critical to get the "weave" exactly right for mechanical purposes, as you can certainly guess.

To create a new weaving process would probably run in the range of between 3 and 5 million dollars. Unless, as I said, they got lucky and found a fabric which already had the right shape in it already, purely by coincidence.

Now, if the shirts are some form of polymer-blend (rayon/polyester, for instance) they could theoretically "iron in" the patterns... essentially, do a small local melt of the fabric fibers to give it a little "sheen" in various locations. This would be practical, but the fabric would be compromised in terms of its strength... meaning that the tunics would probably only last through three wearings (and washings) before they'd need replacement.

But, again, the ONLY time this has ever been done in the past was with what were literally "rubber suits."

Furthermore... think about it... who's going to NOTICE the little symbols in the fabric? If the audience is bored enough by the STORY to be paying attention to the FABRIC WEAVING... then as far as I'm concerned, this'll mean that we have a true BOMB on our hands.

Only us... the "hardcore fans"... will even really care that the costumes are blue, red, and an earth-tone gold... and that's as it should be.

If even the FANS give a flying @#$* about "little symbols" in the fabric... and worse yet, if the production team WANTS US to give a flying @#$* about that... the production is doomed!
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Old August 12 2008, 09:57 PM   #29
ManOnTheWave
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Re: Uniform Differences

cbp44189 wrote: View Post
ManOnTheWave wrote: View Post
While I think the uniforms being made of little chevrons is Superman Returns lame, it's not that far a stretch. And it doesn't look as stupid as having a camo pattern made up of the GIJoe logo. The approach they seem to be taking with TOS unis is just layered athletic wear like Nike, Adidas, or Under Armor. The chevron is also a minor detail you'll barely see onscreen.
Why would it be lame?
I said it would be "Superman Returns lame" because Superman's suit in that film was made of little s's. As for why it would be lame, I don't see a military organization making it's uniforms out of it's symbol. It seems silly to me, like if the army made it camo patterns out of patriotic stars. I then go into a possible reason why it would thematically fit the costumes of TOS and be less silly.
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Old August 12 2008, 10:04 PM   #30
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Re: Uniform Differences

It started with colors... moved on to fabric... and THEN...

Edit: I was replying to jon... who is now posted after this one... and...


head explodes
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