RSS iconTwitter iconFacebook icon

The Trek BBS title image

The Trek BBS statistics

Threads: 139,164
Posts: 5,402,977
Members: 24,753
Currently online: 417
Newest member: kev404

TrekToday headlines

Retro Review: Time’s Orphan
By: Michelle on Aug 30

September-October Trek Conventions And Appearances
By: T'Bonz on Aug 29

Lee Passes
By: T'Bonz on Aug 29

Trek Merchandise Sale
By: T'Bonz on Aug 28

Star Trek #39 Villain Revealed
By: T'Bonz on Aug 28

Trek Big Bang Figures
By: T'Bonz on Aug 28

Star Trek Seekers Cover Art
By: T'Bonz on Aug 27

Fan Film Axanar Kickstarter Success
By: T'Bonz on Aug 27

Two New Starship Collection Ships
By: T'Bonz on Aug 26

Trek Actor Wins Emmy
By: T'Bonz on Aug 26


Welcome! The Trek BBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans. Please login to see our full range of forums as well as the ability to send and receive private messages, track your favourite topics and of course join in the discussions.

If you are a new visitor, join us for free. If you are an existing member please login below. Note: for members who joined under our old messageboard system, please login with your display name not your login name.


Go Back   The Trek BBS > Welcome to the Trek BBS! > General Trek Discussion

General Trek Discussion Trek TV and cinema subjects not related to any specific series or movie.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old April 27 2008, 03:52 AM   #61
Sector 7
Rear Admiral
 
Sector 7's Avatar
 
Location: McCrory/Hitler's Republic of North Carolina
Send a message via AIM to Sector 7
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

Captain X wrote: View Post
Rabittooth wrote: View Post
I disagree. Shatner is the King. Of course it's cornball to some degree...everyone knows it...even the Shat does. And, like him and fans of his performances, I embrace the cheese, and have even learned to LOVE it.
I posted this youtube link in another thread:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWWJuuF_mM0

Classic Shatner...to me...that's awesome.

Anyway...I have no idea what he's like personally other than how he has portrayed himself as in various media (in which he seems like, at least at present, a pretty nice dude), so I can't say that he's a wonderful all-around guy. Sound like he's certainly stepped on some toes in his professional life.
But performances like the one above...Trek would not have been as cool as it was without those moments IMO.

-Rabittooth
If you honestly like the corn, then there isn't anything for it. I don't like it, and I honestly couldn't care less about Shatner being Kirk or someone else playing the character.

misskim86 wrote: View Post
Captain X wrote: View Post
Apparently when ST5 was filming, Wil was brought down from the TNG set to the ST5 shuttlebay set by someone who worked at both shoots and introduced them, and to make a long story short, The Shat was a prick to him, so much so that GR made him apologize to the kid.
wow really? Any details on that?
Ask and you shall receive.
Thanks for the link. With all the vocal ShatHeads in here, I thought I was the only one who felt that way about ShatHead a.k.a. Shitner.
ps.-you wouldn't happen to have a link for part 2 would you?
__________________
“When all Americans are treated as equal, no matter who they are or whom they love, we are all more free.” -Pres. Obama
"A great democracy does not make it harder to vote than to buy an assault weapon." -Pres. Clinton
Sector 7 is offline  
Old April 27 2008, 04:11 AM   #62
EliyahuQeoni
Commodore
 
EliyahuQeoni's Avatar
 
Location: Redmond, Oregon, United States of America, North America, Earth, Sol System, Milky Way, Universe
View EliyahuQeoni's Twitter Profile
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

indranee wrote: View Post
what's interesting (and our luck) is that the scenes these two were in ALWAYS shone. that's a blessing for us all.
Absolutely true. from their on-screen performances you'd never know there was any friction between the two of them personally.
__________________
"Canon is only important to certain people because they have to cling to their knowledge of the minutiae. Open your mind! Be a Star Trek fan and open your mind and say, 'Where does Star Trek want to take me now'." - Leonard Nimoy
EliyahuQeoni is offline  
Old April 27 2008, 04:15 AM   #63
Phillip Culley
Captain
 
Phillip Culley's Avatar
 
Location: Kitchener ON
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

Just did a hunt for Part 2 myself, and it's here
Phillip Culley is offline  
Old April 27 2008, 04:16 AM   #64
EliyahuQeoni
Commodore
 
EliyahuQeoni's Avatar
 
Location: Redmond, Oregon, United States of America, North America, Earth, Sol System, Milky Way, Universe
View EliyahuQeoni's Twitter Profile
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

Sector 7 wrote: View Post
ps.-you wouldn't happen to have a link for part 2 would you?
http://suicidegirls.com/news/geek/20634/

Edit: oops! Phillip beat me to it
__________________
"Canon is only important to certain people because they have to cling to their knowledge of the minutiae. Open your mind! Be a Star Trek fan and open your mind and say, 'Where does Star Trek want to take me now'." - Leonard Nimoy
EliyahuQeoni is offline  
Old April 27 2008, 04:26 AM   #65
Sector 7
Rear Admiral
 
Sector 7's Avatar
 
Location: McCrory/Hitler's Republic of North Carolina
Send a message via AIM to Sector 7
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

^
^^
Thanks to both of you. Wil always was a kool dude. I wish that ST:SA had gone forward. Glad to see he's done alright since then.
__________________
“When all Americans are treated as equal, no matter who they are or whom they love, we are all more free.” -Pres. Obama
"A great democracy does not make it harder to vote than to buy an assault weapon." -Pres. Clinton
Sector 7 is offline  
Old April 27 2008, 06:56 AM   #66
DevilintheDark
Lieutenant
 
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

Captain X wrote: View Post
Rabittooth wrote: View Post
I disagree. Shatner is the King. Of course it's cornball to some degree...everyone knows it...even the Shat does. And, like him and fans of his performances, I embrace the cheese, and have even learned to LOVE it.
I posted this youtube link in another thread:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWWJuuF_mM0

Classic Shatner...to me...that's awesome.

Anyway...I have no idea what he's like personally other than how he has portrayed himself as in various media (in which he seems like, at least at present, a pretty nice dude), so I can't say that he's a wonderful all-around guy. Sound like he's certainly stepped on some toes in his professional life.
But performances like the one above...Trek would not have been as cool as it was without those moments IMO.

-Rabittooth
If you honestly like the corn, then there isn't anything for it. I don't like it, and I honestly couldn't care less about Shatner being Kirk or someone else playing the character.

misskim86 wrote: View Post
Captain X wrote: View Post
Apparently when ST5 was filming, Wil was brought down from the TNG set to the ST5 shuttlebay set by someone who worked at both shoots and introduced them, and to make a long story short, The Shat was a prick to him, so much so that GR made him apologize to the kid.
wow really? Any details on that?
Ask and you shall receive.


If you dont like the "corn" why the hell watch TOS....its corny as hell and that is what makes it great.TNG is basically a soap opera, the others....i dont even know really.Shatner makes TOS what it is, besides Nimoy and Shatner you could replace anyone else on the show and its would still be great.Get rid of Shat and its a whole 'nother show...the pilot did have sort of an Irwin Allen feel to it.....
DevilintheDark is offline  
Old April 27 2008, 08:38 AM   #67
Captain X
Rear Admiral
 
Location: I'm nutty!
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

Uh, I don't really watch TOS all that much, other than some of the episodes I've seen reruns of. Fro mwhat I've seen, it's better than VOY, but the corn factor still places it as second-lowest on my list. My main turn-offs for TNG are the arrogant attitudes and blandness of the vast majority of the characters, but that's a topic for another thread.
Captain X is offline  
Old April 27 2008, 09:03 AM   #68
Good Will Riker
Admiral
 
Location: Southern California, USA
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

Phillip Culley wrote: View Post
Just did a hunt for Part 2 myself, and it's here
True, Shatner was acting like a douche and was quite full of himself.

But, then again, we all have an aspect of ourselves that -- publicly -- would not be all that endearing.
Good Will Riker is offline  
Old April 27 2008, 10:42 AM   #69
darkwing_duck1
Vice Admiral
 
Location: the Unreconstructed South
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

A beaker full of death wrote: View Post
Shatner, for his part, can be a jerk. But it's not personal. The man had a family to feed, so yeah, he had to promote himself to get ahead, and didn't care whose feelings he hurt in the process. It wasn't until the 90s that Shatner realized how people reacted to that, so he learned to temper it.
I'm no great defender of Shatner, but something about his life came to light not long ago that I never knew:

Within a very short time of Trek ending back in the 60s, Shatner was LITERALLY reduced to living out of his car for a time. That can have an effect on a person.

Also, it's my understanding that Shatner and Doohan came to at least a partial understanding with each other not long before Doohan died, so can't we let this go?
darkwing_duck1 is offline  
Old April 28 2008, 02:16 AM   #70
misskim86
Rear Admiral
 
misskim86's Avatar
 
Location: TX, USA
Send a message via Yahoo to misskim86
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

omg thanks for those links guys!!!

Man I felt so bad for Will reading that stuff, I loved how nice Jonathan, Brent, Michael and Gene were to him though, they were so sweet.

Therin of Andor wrote: View Post

You must be very young?

I'm not *that* young I'm 21
__________________
Last Christmas I gave you my heart but the very next day you gave it away
This year to save me from tears I'll give it to someone special

Last edited by misskim86; April 28 2008 at 02:26 AM.
misskim86 is offline  
Old April 28 2008, 03:44 AM   #71
HobartFloyt
Captain
 
Location: Indiana
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

I'm no defender of Shatner, but I think it's obvious that he thought he was playing around a bit with Wil. What Shatner apparently didn't know, and wouldn't being Shatner, is that it doesn't take much to hurt a kid and Wil was one of those too-sensitive types on top of that.

Doesn't excuse being an insensitive jerk, which is everyones main beef, but I don't think he meant to hurt Wil.
HobartFloyt is offline  
Old April 28 2008, 04:51 AM   #72
voggmo
Commodore
 
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

OK, I'm gonna try & be careful how I say this. It's well known what Doohan was unhappy about, the same thing Uhura & Takei were. However, different people react differently to the same event or topic, & I would imagine he was a bit more vocal & "out" so to speak in that place & time than say Uhura would have been. Some people vent their emotions, some people hide em & so on.

Doohan was not a shy man. No I didn't know him personally, hence my disclaimer above, but still we all have different emotional construct is the point I'm trying to make without stepping on toes & such. Doohan went to more conventions than anyone did, & he is the guy I would have liked to meet more than any other.
voggmo is offline  
Old April 28 2008, 08:56 AM   #73
Sarah James
Lieutenant
 
Location: USA/CA
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

KayArr wrote: View Post
Sector 7 wrote: View Post
misskim86 wrote: View Post
Speculation is just fine
I agree, speculation is fine. How dare we let FACTS get in the way of speculation.
I HAVE met and worked with Shatner. Anyone who has KNOWS why so many people hate him, but I won't bore you again. See my post elsewhere.
On the other hand, Jimmy Doohan was one of the kindest folks I ever met who was connected to Hollywood. He did more charity work than any other cast member, to my knowledge. He was the kind of person who would give you the shirt off his back.
Knowing this, it is easy to see why such opposites would not get along.
Hmmmm...a really good person would forgive and forget. Perhaps Doohan did all those things for the attention and adulation. A real class act would never speak ill of anyone, even someone they disliked.
And a REAL human being would always speak the truth as he sees it. Or not? Or do we all stop being human and try to become flawless now? OK You may start trying. Good luck

Last edited by Sarah James; April 28 2008 at 09:14 AM. Reason: spelling
Sarah James is offline  
Old April 28 2008, 09:10 AM   #74
Sarah James
Lieutenant
 
Location: USA/CA
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

misskim86 wrote: View Post
Sarah James wrote: View Post
With each point you listed you couldn't be further away from the truth.

1) Doohan wasn't jealous of Shatner. On the set and at the parties he would avoid the man because he thought Bill was racist, sexist and intolerant.

2) Bill never suggested Jimmy for the part. Bill only suggested that Star Trek could do without an engineer (Doohan) which Jimmy never forgave him.

3) Doohan and Grace Lee Whitney were always best of friends (at one time more than that) right until his death. He was never known to force issues with women. Jimmy worshipped women. All women. But one of the NBC executives working for Star Trek was renowned for being a pest and forcing himself on femal staff. And this person who shall not be named raped Grace, harrassed Nichelle and attacked Takei on several occasions. The person to stand up to him was not Bill Shatner. It was Doohan who got severely reprimanded by a bunch of hypocrites, for being a caring, courageous friend at all times.

That, my friend, is the truth as I know it, right out of the mouth of somebody who is not here to defend himself. So I have to do it for him.
That's super interesting stuff thanks a lot Sarah, do you know know why he thought Bill was racist and intolerant?
Because Bill would bluntly hit on women (ask Nichelle Nichols) thinking they must appreciate his attention as a special honour anyway. He was known to accept a No though and then it was all forgotten. Still, he could be rude in his approach (ask Diana Muldaur).

...and he would make the most insensitive jokes about people of other minorities and get away with it! But of course. It was the 60s and the NBC suits (execs) were the worst racists and chauvinists ever. So he had a grateful audience at parties. Jimmy, on the other hand, decided to cut himself off from that group because amongst his friends there were many black people, Asians, native Americans and homosexuals.

Did you know that Jimmy Doohan loved to attend Jazz cubs? In the offices they made fun of him. Because he would hang out with n...ers. Yup the truth hurts sometimes but that was the situation in the 60s when Martin Luther King was not yet shot dead and still fighting.
Sarah James is offline  
Old April 28 2008, 09:25 AM   #75
Sarah James
Lieutenant
 
Location: USA/CA
Re: Why did Doohan hate Shatner?

As far as William Shatner is concerned, I have to rely on what his former co-workers are willing to tell us about him. And often it is more what is not said then what is said that is so intriguing.

However, if you want to check out a good reference on James Doohan with fun anecdotes and great pictures then I can recommend these links. They are both people, very close to him and one of them is Doohan's own flesh and blood so... they should make good sources.

1) http://www.myspace.com/chrisdoohan

2) http://www.myspace.com/doohansdemon

Let me know what you think
Sarah James is offline  
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 11:46 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.