New JJ Abrams interview

I'm just saying that I think it makes more sense for a Star Trek movie to resemble Prometheus or 2001: A Space Odyssey instead of having The Dark Knight as it's main inspiration. Two of the aforementioned films are about exploring strange new worlds and seeking out new life. The other is..... a crime film featuring Batman.

I think it goes without saying which film a Star Trek film should resemble more. If people are too thick to enjoy a proper Star Trek movie then don't cater to them by giving them something else and slapping the Star Trek name on it. It's just alienated the fans.

 

The whole idea behind Star Trek was that it was a flexible format and they could do any type of story they wished within that format.

 

Well, I for one never watched Star Trek for the fight scenes. Any viewer that did would probably be very disappointed .

 

"It goes without saying"? What do you think we're debating here, then, exactly?

"Too thick"? I'm not sure your vindictive attitude is conducive to a healthy debate. I'm a Star Trek fan, I'm reasonably smart and I don't feel alienated by "Star Trek". Quite the contrary, I enjoyed it quite a lot.

 

I must have been imagining all those fight scenes in TOS...

 

The amazing, varied choreography for Kirk's fights dazzled you so much that you forgot them.

 

Why? There have been hundreds of fight scenes in Trek since it started airing decades ago with TOS.

As for that alienation of the fans, it is just as imaginary as the idea that Star Trek has been mainly highly intellectual, resembling 2001.
Star Trek has done just about every story in the book over the decades, except a full musical if I'm not forgetting anything.

 

I say this with nary a hint of irony - I LOVE the fist fights in TOS, choreography included.

 

I guess, since I wasn't alienated, I'm not a true fan. All those years watching the shows, the movies, buying the videos and DVDs and novels... all for nothing.

But it's okay I'm too thick to realize. Phew!

 

You're Mr. Thick Thick Thickety Thick-face from Thick-town, Thickania

 

Well, being unable to understand my simple post doesn't help your claim for intelligence .

You're obviously not too thick to understand Star Trek if you're a fan of the pre-Abrams stuff.

 

TNG movies bombed because they were basically just mediocre TV episodes, that accidentally made their way to the big screens. Written by people who lost their "mojo" years ago, directed by people who didn't care enough, produced on a budget ridiculously low for today's standards.

It's exactly why ENT crashed and burned as well.[/QUOTE]

Yes, The TNG movie mostly failed except for First Contact. Now that was a proper TNG/ST movie.

The one before was really disappointing and there was really no reason Kirk was required to be in it.

ST9 was in my book a two part TNG episode that possible was a script sitting around from season 7.

The last one was just G-d awful from the story, directing, editing.

The last two TNG movies and the remaining season of Voyager had started the process of killing trek.

Then Enterprise is when the writers behind the show really lost the mojo.

Other then Season three with Xindi arc all before were inconsistent writing. There were a few gems here and there and it was not until season four that the show began to see promise but then was canceled.

I myself really enjoyed ST09 and look forward to the next incarnation. I am die hard fan but not so narrow minded that I can enjoy be open to enjoying the new trek.

We should all be happy that ST09 was a success otherwise there could have been no new trek at all.

Or sometime down the road a complete re-image we Spoke was to be a woman and other drastic changes.... (New BSG)

 

Jar Jar Trek 2009 did well because it had a HUGE marketing push. Nemesis (Which is only marginally better), bombed because only us even knew it was out.

I wouldn't equate film quality with box office success. It's all about marketing. Abrams is a master of self-publicity.

 

Trek 2009 did well because people who saw it liked it and recommended it.

Nemesis did poorly because people who saw it, in the main, didn't think much of it.

It is that simple.

oldTrek ended because it deserved to end; the Franchise earned that retirement by steadily and predictably declining viewership over a decade.

 

I saw Nemeses on opening day and the theater was empty. The review were awful and it very disappointing.

Before the movie was released the script was leaked to the internet and it included all types of comments like "this scene was the same why Ming was killed in Flash Gordon" or how this scene was the same from the last movie... and so on.

Or this part went against the prime directive or how is there always in movies a bottom less pit that the bad guys fall into. The Troi mind rape was the same from ST6.

Then sitting watching the movie on opening night it was same as the leaked script and Stuart Byrd as director was a bad choice and the it was truly a bad movie.

It also did not help that the budget was cut more then once and Paramount turned a good possible premise into a bomb.

Even when Worf is asked when the fleet will arrive to support the Enterprise with stopping the Scimitar?
His reply is not until Tuesday almost the same like Capt. Harriom states in Generations regarding the tractorbeam.

It also did not help that John Logan and Brent Spinner wrote the story it was just bad trek.

 

What? Not really. By that point people have already bought their ticket so quality is meaningless, it's all about marketing. Unless you think Transformers 2: Revenge of the Fallen earned more than Blade Runner because it's a better film? Wait, don't even answer that.


And I'm far from alone in thinking Abrams' Trek is poor. It's really split the fandom. Every Trekkie on the videogame forum I go on thinks it's terrible and shat on the legacy.

Nemesis is better Star Trek than JJ-Trek and Shinzon is a far superior villain to Nero. Both are stupid action movies though and along with Generations form the worst movies of the franchise.

 

Yet the DVD sold 7 million copies, with Bluray sales on top of that. If nobody liked it at the cinema, they definitely wouldn't have paid to own it.

Vocal minority

 

Okay, but we all got the point during the couple dozen times Abrams said that about Trek XI. Does he really need to keep repeating that? Even I eventually gave up my "Learning to count, Abrams style" avatar.

Although you do make some valid points, using The Cage as the benchmark Trek should aspire to probably isn't a good idea. Don't get me wrong, I love The Cage, but one has to remember it was rejected for being too cerebral. TOS is basically dumbed down Trek, out of necessity. I agree that TOS writers had a lot more talent and imagination than Abrams and his minions, but if the capabiliies had existed in the 1960s, TOS would basically be CG and splosions. It would have to be to air on NBC.

 

Correct minority . And we can't be that much of a minority if the cast and crew feel the need to randomly snipe at us in interviews.

I REALLY want to love the next move. The first 9 minutes sound like great, fun TOS adventure. It's this bland Nolan Batman stuff with Cumberbatch that looks boring to me. Yet for some reason everybody on here is jizzing over it?

"I want my revenge bwahahaha!"

We had this in the previous two movies. And Nero is my most hated character in Trek history so this makes me nervous.

I actually agree with every word of this. It's that "light entertainment" aspect of TOS that bothers me despite it being one of my fave things ever made by mankind. Still, at least episodes like The Trouble With Tribbles could be un-cerebral yet still engaging, exciting and genuinely funny.

 

It wasn't so much that "The Cage" was too cerebral (intelligent TV did exist in the 1960s), as NBC said it was short on action for a TV show that promised action and adventure. After all, Roddenberry promised "Wagon Train" to the stars, not another version of "The Twilight Zone". I don't think they actually dumbed things down for WNMHGB, for example. Certainly, the best of TOS wasn't dumbed down, either.

That said, it is no more fair to cherry-pick and compare "The Cage" to ST09 and conclude ST09 is crap than it is to compare ST09 to "The Way to Eden", "The Spectre of the Gun", "The Savage Curtain", "The Enemy Within", "And the Children Shall Lead", and God forbid, "Spock's Brain" and conclude it's genius.