This is how this goes for all you Heroes fans out there. I start off the story and each of you adds onto it with what you think happens next: It’s the end of the Season 1 finale. Nathan arrives just in time to take Pete up to the sky for him to explode safely above the city. But just when they are in mid-flight, a mysterious man hiding in the shadows of Kirby Plaza shoots Nathan. Nathan begins to fall and Peter suddenly explodes before they could hit Kirby Plaza. Now what?
Start season 2 with a new cast (as originally intended), excent for Claire because she would have been able to survive that, maybe Hiro still went back to fuedal Japan, but majority of season 2 would have been about the fallout NYC post blast and how the government would respond to it. mysterious man could very well still be Adam Monroe/Takezo Kensei. also prob could have had elements of the best parts of generations, villains and fugitives in season 2 as well a deeper richer history of primatec would be explored and the only way the relevent actors of the overall story from season 1 would be seen again is thru flashbacks and maybe instances of shape shifting/altered realities (Parkman's Dad) Hiro loses his innocense and becomes more warrior-like because of his training in Feudal Japan comes back to the present to seek answers, teams up with some of new cast. Comes to the realization early on that messing with time is not the answer, thus avoiding any major convoluted plot points like how we actually got. Introduce characters like Samuel early on, but ditch the whole carnival aspect. Basically a Magneto-esque archetype.
I would also think Pete would have survived the blast as well, using Claire's regenerative ability. And I think because of the blast Peter's ability to absorb other people's abilities would have affected as a result. He would have been only able to absorb one ability at time. Any more would result in a power overload like before.
Convince me that they wouldn't be a cast full of Alejandros and Mayas. Given the track record of casting and writing characters on that show, I think sticking to the original plan would have gotten the show cancelled long before now. The writing would suck either way, since you're not talking about changing the writing staff, and what's kept people watching anyway is that they happen to like this or that character. In a situation like that, ditching characters can be fatal to the ratings. The luck of the draw in the casting and basic conception for the original characters is all this show has going for it. I don't mind the S1 finale. The show went off the rails starting in S2.
Agreed. It's hard as hell to make a successful show and hard as hell to do that with one cast. You got a cast that helped make the show so successful in the first season? You really want to throw that away to take another chance at catching lightning in a bottle? As Temis said, their new characters have by and large either sucked (The Wonder Twins) or have been woefully used (Adam Monroe). Heroes might have gone down in flames much sooner by scrapping everything the first season. Anyone remember that they were supposed to do a Heroes Origin series but it got scrapped due to the writer's strike?
I'll bet that Heroes: Origin series would have been utterly dreadful. Remember how bad the flashback-to-the-mutant-concentration-camp episode was? Leave the characters alone. Fire the writers.
With a little ingenuity, cohesive and susinct writing and real attentive casting choices, I think they could have pulled it off. Sure characters like Maia and Alexandro flopped, but I think it has more to do with what we actually got with their story and their situation than it does with the characters themselves. But yeah, let me retract a little bit, maybe not replace the whole cast, or have a revolving door of a new cast but at least have some of the original cast trickle down, like it ultimately has been. Further expanding the story. Point being I was trying to make reference by expanding the universe of Heroes but still keeping it tight niche with the history of what we thought at the time was this evil company, Primatech and what their motive was. Further explore the backstory of them and let them be the main focus of what was going down. Around this time we didn't really know they were the "good guys" right? What we eventually got as seasoned 3 rolled around was all over the map and a clusterf*ck of a mess, don't you think? Think about it, in an alternate season 2, let's say Angelas plan backfires on her, not only did Peter die by leveling New York but so did Nathan by attempting to save the day, but is killed for his troubles, which is the whole point of this thread right? Then again around this time we didn't know Tim Kring and company couldn't really manage to follow thru with succesfully making the show better and better from volume to volume. Sure it has its share of good episodes and clever revelations about some of the characters within the story, but if you think about the show as a whole and where its at now. It has been an abysmal mess. If this show was supposed to be NBC's answer to "Lost" then honestly I think they could have done a better job at being that answer. Every season, I like probably some of you guys, wish for things to be better, so I stick around and will mostly likely stick around to the end of the show. If I could stick around with a show like Smallville, than this is a cakewalk, believe you me. Don't get me wrong guys, I still enjoy the show, for what it is. Its just a bit disappointing on how everything played out. They had so many missed opportunities that would have made the story so much better, in my opinion. I'm no writer, so what do I know. However I do know, that things could have been better. Back to Heroes another point that has been addressed numerous of times, which I never really put much thought into until this thread came about is that there are characters on this show that have been around way too long and don't really seem to add anything anymore to the overall story, which is still what exactly? We're freakin' 4 seasons in, and still don't really know what the endgame is to this show. If apologize if it sounds like I'm rambling, but I'm typing on my iPhone and it sucks to do so.
Re-reading this post, I do agree with this notion. Let's get back into our time machine and fire the writers and improve the story!
If you're assuming they're competent, why can't they be competent with the S1 characters? Overall, the S1 characters got whittled down to a fairly workable bunch, without a lot of deadwood. Nathan & Peter - Their touchy but touching relationship was one of the highlights of the show. Get Nathan into politics in S2, have some huge catastrophe happen by the end of S2 or mid S3, which propels Nathan to sensibly seek the "Mutant Gitmo" solution, which drives the wedge with Peter. Claire & Noah - The pingpong routine got old pretty quickly. They should have had her grow up more quickly. Noah's recent realization that he can redeem himself by not hunting the metahumans but attempting to help them - and yes, most of them desperately need help - would have stopped some of the pingponging by removing the ethical dilemma to Noah's actions. Mohinder - A show like this needs a scientist character. By no means should he ever have been given superpowers. Instead, he should continue the path he was on in S1/S2 - realizing that for many people, the powers are too much to control - and try to create a cure or at least a therapy. Matt - There should have been more recognition that his mind-reading and mind-control powers can only be used unethically. At best, it's vigilante activity. As a cop, I would hope Matt would have a rigid moral sense that would at least set up a conflict, even if he ends up using his powers more and more. The Sanders Family - Just kill Nikki. DL was okay, keep him for a while. But I kinda like the idea of Micah being an orphan forced to survive on his wits from a very young age. I wish they hadn't just dropped him from the show. Hiro - I'm stumped. The way the character was conceived as babyish comic relief doesn't give the writers anyplace interesting to go. I didn't buy Badass Future Hiro, but hey maybe the solution is to make Hiro a birran? Overall, that sounds like pretty good dramatic fodder to me. What new characters could be invented that would have more potential?
If they had allowed Hiro's time in feudal Japan and the impact of his father being killed to stick to his character, Hiro could have become more of a grim, haunted character weary of the weight of his heroic destiny like Wesley in Season 4 or Season 5 of Angel. And I would have liked to see a romance develop between Peter and Nikki at some point, which we saw a glimpse of in Five Years Gone.
The problem I had with Future Hiro is he had no personality whatsoever. About Nathan seeking out Mutant Gitmo, the only thing that made less sense than that was the fact that none of those he was locking up spilled the beans to the Feds.
That was my entire point. Not one of those people was pissed off enough to rat out Nathan, or at least try? It made not one shred of sense in terms of human nature.
I don't think Masi Oka has the acting skill to convincingly convey Future Hiro - scowling in a constipated fashion does not say "badass" to me. But I just cannot envision any other role that would be a more interesting direction to take the character. And we certainly don't need both Badass Future Hiro and Badass Future Peter (Milo is no better at that routine than Masi). If having mutants running around wreaking havok had resulted in some huge catastrophe - half of NYC blowing up for real - then Nathan being desperate to stop the carnage might have justified that plotline. He can be a ruthless person. They just didn't set up his motive properly so it seemed like he'd just flat out gone insane. And I'd envision a scenario where the public knows about the mutants, and are the ones clamoring to be protected from them by having them all locked up in Mutant Gitmo. With a big enough catstrophe having happened, that's exactly what people would do - trade someone else's freedom for your own safety. And after all, they're mutants and therefore freaks and outsiders. I can see it happening, easily. So, there are no Feds to spill the beans to. They're the ones trying to lock up the dangerous freaks before they murder millions more people. If one of the freaks rats out Nathan as a mutant, who would believe them? They'd have a motive to lie, to undermine public faith in Senator Petrelli. As long as Nathan was the one who instigated the round-up, he'd be seen as a public hero and above suspicion. Nathan should have the political savvy to pull it off successfully. He just needs a motive that doesn't paint him as being a darker person than he is.
Of all the non-passive powers on the show, Hiro's is the most god-like. He's traveled into the past and inspired a legend, his archnemesis waded through time to murder his father, he's trained as a samurai in order to defeat a great villain, he owns the sword of his own legend, and he is the CEO of a megacorporation. And that doesn't include all of the other things that would -- should -- have lead him down the path of becoming Future Hiro. Who wasn't Badass Future Hiro, but a somber, terrified, and hunted Hiro who just happened to be a badass out of necessity. Every enemy that knows of his power is terrified of him. He's always at the very top of the Most Wanted list every time one comes up. He is badass. The writers just refuse to evolve the character despite having already shown an evolved version of the character. Masi could pull it off just fine. As mentioned, Future Hiro wasn't a badass in personality. He was scared and distraught, which he hid behind a stoic face that was more for his own benefit than anyone else's. He does that even as Present Hiro; it's a default trait of his; take a deep breath, keep a straight face, and say what he needs to say. He didn't carry a sword to look cool, he did it because he was constantly being hunted and it's the only weapon he had any training in thanks to his father. And top all of that off with the power to warp time and space on a whim, and why wouldn't he appear as a badass even though he wasn't in personality? He'd simply be a cautious character with a bigger-picture view of things. A view he most certainly should have considering his powers and all the things that have been fucked up with him using it. Bah. Anyway, the only thing I truly hate about Hiro's character is, again, the writer's mental retardation. Future Hiro was completely obsessed with the consequences of "rifts." He refused to travel back in time to change anything major, and we saw why when he tried to save Charlie's life the first time. Something pulled him away from kissing her and something prevented him from being able to go back to her. Yet now, all of that is utterly forgotten -- no, utterly ignored. Apparently, he could have gone back to her any time he wanted. Even though he couldn't. And all without any notable consequence other than his counterpart tossing her to some random point in time and space at the cost of his own life. Then there's the whole thing with the Irish chick and what Peter did to her. But I don't even want to think of how horrific it is of the writer's to just ignore that storyline as if it were nothing. Meh, sorry. I started off with a point in mind but I just wandered off to a rant. I'm just really, really disappointed with the direction the show has gone and all the wasted potential for what could have truly been an epic story all around.
Funny how that happens, start off with a point and end up ranting, I did the same thing, I totally concur though, Heroes could have been so much more and it was squandered on some really lame stuff that either never really went anywhere or fell flat and became sort of anticlimactic it did have a handful of memorable moments, we'll see how the rest of this season plays out
You're seeing a lot more in his performance than was actually present. "Scared and distraught"? Never quite noticed that. His performance never went beyond video-game-character type posturing. But your ideas would be good, if Hiro were played by a better actor. And the writers actually wrote the character like you described. Masi Oka never had a chance to perform the character like that because the writers never bothered to even put it in the script. Hiro was written as a video game character and performed as a video game character, with zero depth or anything of interest. Like many things on this show, salvaging Hiro would require tearing everything up from the floorboards and starting over.
Sad to say there aren't really that many Asian American actors in Hollywood or so it seems. Feels like at least within the last 7 years or so where more and more have been popping up, that excluding the likes of your John Cho's or your Daniel Dae Kims, so to cast a Japanese character who doesn't look very physically imposing and has a child like personality. To go from that to the more serious tone of Future Hiro, I thnk Masi did ok. Let's just say straight up we've all grown sick of Hiro's antics and delusions of grandeur and wish him to finally grow the fuck up. At least I do anyways. It almost seems like Ando is maturing more as a character than Hiro has