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Old January 6 2014, 04:34 AM   #319
Timby
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Re: MLB Offseason 2013-2014

Pegaritaville wrote: View Post
Timby wrote: View Post
Yanks wrote: View Post
Oh, what the hell.
Jack Morris - I remember him as one of the best of his era. He won 36 more games and threw 291 more innings than any other pitcher in baseball from 1977-94. Is he a Mattox? ... Clemons? no - but I think he should be in.

...

Schilling - Nope, 216 wins isn't enough.
Wins are an artificial statistic that has no bearing upon a pitcher's performance, and Morris was never even the best pitcher on his own team. Being an innings eater doesn't make you a great pitcher -- ask Aaron Sele.

Edit: And Maddux is not getting 100%. If Seaver didn't, no one is.
I think Morris should get in, but I also realize that as a Twins fan, I'm biased. Still, he was more than just an inning eater- he pitched a lot of great games (including a doozy in the World Series).
Assuming you're referring to Game 7, it was indeed a doozy of a game ... but, again, not because of Morris, but because Lonnie Smith was an idiot.

Again, what did Morris do in his career that was of particular note, performance-wise, besides eating a fuckton of innings? He gave up a lot of dingers, he had a few seasons of being strikeout king, never finished higher than third in Cy Young voting. He never had a run of being the best pitcher in the AL, to say nothing of the major leagues, and you can make arguments that he was only the second-best starter on both the Detroit and Minnesota staffs.

Going back to what I wrote on this topic a year ago:

Morris is an absolutely terrible Hall of Fame candidate. JAWS has him as the 167th best starting pitching candidate for the Hall. Let's say that method is massively unkind to Morris and he's actually in the 60s; only one person from 60-69 is in, and all but Eddie Cicotte are eligible. He'd instantly become one of the worst pitchers in the Hall. I'd be hard-pressed to even call him a borderline candidate; he belongs in the Hall of Good.

The following pitchers were better than Jack Morris, statistically speaking, in roughly the same era and didn't have a prayer at getting into the Hall: Dave Stieb, David Cone, Kevin Brown, Orel Hershiser, Brett Saberhagen, David Wells, Kevin Appier.
I don't see anyone saying that Wells or Hershiser are Hall of Famers, but because of Game 7, there's a ridiculous narrative around Morris. I don't get it. Again: Take Game 7 out of it, and what case do you have?

This will be his last shot and I hope he gets in, but if he falls short, I can understand that as well.
The Veterans Committee will elect him in '15 or '16 ('16 being more likely in my mind, because then they could put him in alongside Trammell, who will never get elected, despite him being one of the best shortstops of all time).

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: View Post
Jerry Coleman has died. Link
This is a huge bummer; Coleman was one of the all-time greats. We're going to be losing more of them, soon: Vin Scully doesn't have much time left, nor do Ralph Kiner or Milo Hamilton.
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