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Old August 21 2013, 03:41 PM   #73
trevanian
Rear Admiral
 
Re: The curse of even Trek Films and the reboot - thought

Hober Mallow wrote: View Post
Smellmet wrote: View Post
Should Data have died? Yes. Could the ending of the film been and his death been a little less depressing? I think so, I give the film 8/10
Actually, this kinda highlights the problem I had with not being able to be engaged by the film. The death of Data should have been emotional for me, but it fell totally flat. I felt absolutely nothing about it or any other element of the film.
Yeah, agree completely. For me, the biggest failings of NEM and GEN aren't the obvious plotting & credibility issues with their storylines, but the fact that we have the deaths of Kirk and Data and both demises carry absolutely zero emotional import.

Kirk's death (both versions, but especially the release version) just seem like outtakes or rehearsals, with no credibility at all.

Data's just seems like they figured Goldsmith would find a way to elevate the most pedestrian staging/shooting to godhood the way he did most limp bits in Trek films. Christ, they could have stolen a page from the end of ARMAGEDDON and put in subliminal cuts of Data's life-experiences while the phaser fired, just ANYthing to connect the audience with this character in farewell. But Baird's idea of directing is just piling up tons of film to mess with it in post; he doesn't seem to have any idea of how to stage for film or what you need to do to when letting a scene play uncut for a time. He has no business behind the camera based on the three utterly lousy films he made, which besides Goldsmith scores have almost nothing to offer.

I don't blame Carson on GEN; I think he got what he could but that Shatner probably couldn't invest in the scene the way he needed to. Perhaps Meyer could have gotten a good death out of Kirk with 70 takes, running Shatner till he was exhausted enough to actually LOOK like he was dying, but given that they weren't going to go gory enough to really make him look like he fell a great distance AND had a bridge land on him, it was probably going to be an uphill battle to sell it anyway.
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