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Old July 7 2013, 10:58 PM   #664
Bad Thoughts
Location: Containment Area for Relocated Yankees
Re: Roddenberry's Worst Ideas

T'Girl wrote: View Post
Bad thoughts wrote: View Post
What does stability have to do with it?
If you're avocating being moneyless,
No, I am not.

And for most of the history of European and the Mediterranean, up until 1500, most transactions were conducted without money.
That not completely true, there was a combination of barter, and the use of cowry shells and precious/base metal coins. Charlemagne in the eighth century standardize coinage in a large section of Europe (also weights and measures used in barter).
My point was not that moneyless societies continued to exist, but that most transactions were still conducted without money. They supply of money was not sufficient to make that otherwise. The fact that many states introduced currency systems does not change that fact. 1500 (or rather the 16th century) is a watershed in this respect because the extraction of precious metals from the New World allowed European power to mint higher quantities of coin (eventually representing symbolically in paper) that would allow for greater economic flexibility. Even so, there are many reports, well into the 19th century, the peasants throughout Europe bartered, paid in kind with labor, or used dated coins, some as old as the Roman Empire, to conduct their business.

Again, look at the long history of humanity: Many wealthy societies survived without it.
But as you yourself noted, those societies did have some form of formalize units of exchange. A predetermined measure of grain/oats with a recognized value within the society, is a unit of exchange. Not exactly a gold coin, but yes a form of money.
If the standards are being made in terms of something that has a direct value, then it is not money. It might suggest money at some point, some means of innovating transactions, but it is still based on something that has an value of its own. Saying otherwise is putting the cart before the horse, historically speaking..
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