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Old June 29 2013, 06:51 PM   #670
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Re: Star Trek Into Darkness & The Bechdel Test

Spock/Uhura Fan wrote: View Post
CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
Spock/Uhura Fan wrote: View Post
The problem is with how the scene was written and how it played out. It's that simple. I don't know if you are not getting my point or if you are just choosing not to, but it is a valid point nonetheless.
No. They get your point. They're trying to show how it has zero merit.
It does not have "zero merit." And "trying" would be the operative word.
Actually, it does have zero merit. Because it rests on a false premise. Uhura is not made to look weak in the scene at all, much less because of her sex. She is the SECONDARY character in the scene. ANY SECONDARY character, male or female, would have been portrayed exactly the same way in that specific scene as far as subduing Khan is concerned.

BillJ wrote: View Post
CorporalClegg wrote: View Post
No. They get your point. They're trying to show how it has zero merit.
Pretty much this.

It was obvious that Khan was playing possum on the bridge of the Vengeance as he pops his eye open almost immediately after Scott stuns him.

But taking that into account would nullify the point about Uhura needing help and we can't have that. Can we?
Well, she did need help. You saw the film. That's how the scene played out.
Again, not because she is a woman. Because she is the secondary character. Spock and Kirk are, alone, the primary characters of this film. When Kirk became incapacitated, the ONLY character left who would EVER be written as the one to subdue the main villain is the OTHER primary character--Spock. Sex, gender roles, sexism, misogyny--NONE of those things matter for that specific denouement. Primary vs. secondary character is the ONLY factor at play here. That is where the absurdity and "zero merit" for your argument lie. Your overall concern about the way women are portrayed in the film is not absurd on the face of it--there were certainly a number of instances where different artistic choices could have been made to bring greater balance to female/male roles and behaviour. But what IS absurd is the specific example you are citing here. If you objected to the notion that Uhura is a secondary character and put forth a coherent argument that she should be a primary character (and thus treated as such throughout the film), your criticism would hold some water as then it would be a choice between giving "the moment" to one or another PRIMARY character. However, that has not been your line of argument. Instead, you complain that a primary character gets "the moment" over a secondary character--which would happen REGARDLESS of the sex of that character--and attempt to portray it as a sign of sexism and misogyny. And that is absurd.
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