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Old June 28 2013, 08:38 PM   #15
Location: Great Britain
Re: Endgame was awesome!

R. Star wrote: View Post

So you have future Janeway willing to change the timeline. Well that might almost make some sense except for why at that point? Why not a few weeks earlier to save Carey? Why not stop them from getting stranded at all? Her original plan was -not- to destroy the transwarp hub after all, to just get them home. Though I guess you could argue that all she wanted to save Seven and she's more important than all the other people on Voyager who died. Though that doesn't make our heroine exactly look good.

Then the Borg... well let's just take away any menacing presence they once had at all. Seriously, the way Voyager was invincible with it's batmobile armor and gunning down Borg Cubes with one shot, I've seen more plausible scenarios involving godmode on video games. Which essentially this is what it was, but if that's not enough they have to technobabble destroy the whole Collective's super technobabble transwarp whatever that conveniently leads all the way to Earth. Boy that would've been useful for the Borg in Best of Both Worlds or First Contact.

As I said, I liked the future part at first, but once it came apparent it was just a plot device to get future Janeway to the past with godmode gear, it lost any dramatic effect. Barclay's cured? So what... Tuvok got Vulcan Alzhemiers? Oh well. Chakotay's dead? Too bad. Seven? Well we'll fix that too and remove any drama while we're at it. If you're going to handwave away these dramatic moments and consequences... you lose the drama and meaning in even putting them on screen too.

The visual effects were nice, but I've said many times they enhance an episode, they don't define it. If you sprinkle sugar on crap... it's still crap. Wrap the whole package in a bowtie with absolutely no resolution beyond a single line saying they're home and a two second shot of them flying towards Earth while the end credits pop up and you end the series on a rather disappointing note.

Though at least it wasn't These Are the Voyages...
Zippo and Flask wrote: View Post
Here's the problem with Endgame. In "Eye of the Needle", only 7 episodes into season 1, the Voyager crew refused an offer to have their expedition to the Bad Lands prevented because they had already made a significant impact on the lives of people in the Delta Quadrant.

So, the precedent had been set that you shouldn't undo "history". Yet in Endgame, there was suddenly no problem with undoing 20 years of unseen Voyager history. If the immorality of changing their own timelines was being ignored, then it would have made more sense to stop Voyager from being stranded in the Delta Quadrant in the first place.
These are more or less my issues with the episode.

As has been pointed out as early as season one, Janeway made the descion that they shouldn't try and stop their mission from being lauched ("Eye of the Needle") yet a few years later who cares if we change the lives of who knows how many people. And why not go back even further and prevent all those deaths and prevent Voyager from being stranded in the first place, or even a few weeks and save Carey?

Surely the Starfleet which monitors the future as seen in "Relativity" would just undo such a massive change to the timeline.

Oh and lets not forgot the Borg have a transwarp conduict exit almost on Earth's doorstep, but stay instead of sending a ship to assimalte Earth via that way thus minimsing the time Starfleet has to mobilise to defend. lets send a ship the old fashioned way right through Federation space.
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