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Old June 24 2013, 05:55 PM   #616
Fleet Captain
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Re: Star Trek Into Darkness & The Bechdel Test

Locutus of Bored wrote: View Post
The whole point of the film is that he has to grow in order to become the captain he was meant to be, and after finally fumbling through things for a while he accomplished that at the end by realizing vengeance is wrong, being humbled and apologizing, sacrificing his life for his shipmates, treating Carol as a valued officer and member of the Enterprise family and not a potential conquest, and making an impassioned memorial speech, ethics mission statement, and a call for exploration at the end.
I totally agree with that in principle. I just don't think Kirk demonstrates having grown much as far as gender relations goes. And we're so busy connecting the dots on the Trek II homage that his sacrifice doesn't feel organic at all.

The cut scene in Trek '09 where he apologizes to the Gaila-lookalike would have done a lot to make him seem to grow, but the fact JJ cut that scene out says it all about his low-priority he is on character-development.

Locutus of Bored wrote: View Post
How will we live down being compared to a fun billion dollar grossing critically and fan acclaimed film series?!
It's a weak argument to keep sarcastically quipping about box-office figures to prove a movie has critical merit.

Locutus of Bored wrote: View Post
And yeah, you are supposed to laugh at the turbolift scene. I guess the audiences I saw the film with aren't as highbrow as you, because we all thought it was funny and not the abomination before Goddenberry you apparently felt it was.
Congratulations. You outed me. I'm a film-snob and you are one with the common-folk who want nothing more than to enter the theater and forget their cares. How dare I ask for anything more from a movie than a few yuks and 2 hours of escapism?

You see? I can do belittling sarcasm too. It doesn't really further the argument, though.

Locutus of Bored wrote: View Post
I and others have accepted it and have come up with deeper meaning behind that scene too, so don't presume to think your rigid and humorless take on how things should be is the norm.
You "came up with it" because it's largely a figment of your imagination and not something that's really evident in the story and how it's presented. If that were the case, JJ wouldn't have all but apologized for it on the talk-show circuit, so he's kind of already confessed that it was gratuitous. I know you feel it is more, but you are grasping at straws.
Star Trek: Earhart
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