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Old June 9 2013, 09:16 PM   #17
Fleet Captain
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Location: At star's end.
Re: Look out Einstein, here come Weinstein

YellowSubmarine wrote: View Post
Edit_XYZ wrote: View Post
The Higgs is an arbitrary add-on, much like dark matter or dark energy.
It's put there not because a theory predicted it, but because it's something that must be added to theory in order to conform to experiment.
Those are two are different ways to say the same thing.
Not even close.

YellowSubmarine wrote: View Post
Pavonis wrote: View Post
What good is a theory that doesn't conform to experimental results? That's a rhetorical question, by the way.
Was Newtonian mechanics wrong when it failed to correctly predict the orbit of Uranus and they had to make up that Neptune planet to conform to experiment?

The introduction of a new particle as a consequence of your theory and experimental results is by definition a prediction from your theory. The merits of it depend solely on whether the prediction was actually true. Neptune exists? Score for Newton. Planet X doesn't exist under Mercury? Newton loses.

Same with the Higgs. If the Higgs exists, it is a valid prediction that adds additional confirmation for the validity of the Standard model, if the Higgs doesn't exist then I'm sorry Standard model, it was nice having you.
The Higgs (or dark matter, dark energy) is not a prediction. It's the equivalent of epicycles.

By using enough such add-ons, you can make your pet idea - any idea, really - fit the physical universe, creating "theories".
But there's no coherence to them, no unifying principle or why, just a salad of arbitrary add-ons - just you looking at experimental results and conflating your pet idea. This is why such "theories" will never yield useful predictions - or be otherwise of use.

And, of course, seeing how your pet idea becomes unfalsifiable by the addition of such add-ons - this is why they're not even science.

PS - "Planet X doesn't exist under Mercury? Newton loses."
Yes - as in, you don't invent arbitrary add-ons to save a theory proven false.
"Let truth and falsehood grapple ... Truth is strong" - John Milton

Last edited by Edit_XYZ; June 9 2013 at 09:31 PM.
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