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Old May 4 2013, 05:53 AM   #152
Rear Admiral
Re: Revisiting the films...

Greg Cox wrote: View Post
gottacook wrote: View Post
Therin of Andor wrote: View Post
Cameos by Kyle (ST II), Rand (STs III and IV) and Chapel aren't "needless insertions" for fans of those characters.
I hadn't heard about the extra Chapel scene - was it written but not filmed? By "needless" I simply meant she was given no dialogue that was meaningful to the story or revealing of her as a character - practically no dialogue at all, for that matter.

trevanian wrote: View Post
The worst for me is the fact Kirk doesn't SEE his son killed. You can justify Kirk's reaction -- but to do so he needs to see it, not hear Saavik have to say the dramatically unplayable "Admiral ... David is dead" line.
Unplayable is right, especially if your character is supposed to be some kind of Vulcan. But as far as seeing him killed, we don't even see that Saavik sees him at that moment. Was Nimoy reluctant to show the actual killing? Was it scripted to occur offstage? Or was it filmed but edited out later for some reason? I don't recall this being addressed on the TSFS commentary track (which I enjoyed, for Robin Curtis' contribution among others).
Just a wild theory: Maybe there was some concern about protecting the film's PG rating? Perhaps having David murdered onscreen might have been judged as too intense?

(Note that in Wrath of Khan, the bit where Khan tortures and slaughters the staff at the space station also occurs offstage. Perhaps for the same reason?)
Didn't even have PG13 invented yet, and while TEMPLE OF DOOM was this same year, that stuff was a lot more graphic than showing a knife going into this blonde kid. You know they weren't going to do it as a PSYCHO knifing, so I can't see ratings being an issue here at all.

I would guess the handling of the killing was a matter of taste (when protoSpock inadvertently kills a klingon that also barely registers), but my view has always been that Nimoy should never have taken the scene on stage as written, for the reason I cited above. But then I also blame him for taking the Romulan out of Saavik (I remember in the novelization she just goes berserk after David is killed, being phasered or disruptored over & over till she is finally blasted unconscious.) It kinda bugs me that Alley got the good scenes to play (and didn't do all of them that well) whereas Curtis had the talent but only got the dregs.

With TWOK, I think showing all that would have been a needless digression, because you can already see what Khan is capable in his eyes .... I just rewatched TWOK tonight and was amazed at just how powerful his early scenes are, just with the implied menace (probably didn't even need to show as much with the eels -- always hated that giant fake ear.) I thought his performance weakens a lot as it goes on, but perhaps that is because he is doing most of his performing against an unseen opponent later on, rather than with live actors. Or it could be a deficiency in Meyer's work, I dunno.
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