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Old April 10 2013, 04:52 AM   #48
The Overlord
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Re: Why is DC so far behind Marvel in terms of movies?

Christopher wrote: View Post
The Overlord wrote: View Post
See the problem I have with that is, with the Hulk TV show is, they hardly had any characters from the comics in that show.
Well, yes, that's my point. It wasn't like the comics in any way -- in fact, other than the recent Mark Valley Human (Standing Next to the) Target, I can't think of a single comic-book adaptation that had less in common with the source material -- yet it's beloved by many Hulk fans to this day because it was, quite simply, a good show in its own right. Fidelity to the source, in terms of action or visuals or anything else, is nice, but its absence can be forgiven if the show is just plain well-written. People try to concoct so many explanations for what factors make a show succeed or fail, but they're overlooking the simple and obvious answer: good writing, good acting, a talented staff. As long as you have those, the rest is negotiable.
Negotiable for you perhaps, but not me.

The Hulk TV show is a bit before my time, so I can't comment a lot on it. But see I like the Hulk and I no interest in that show, I prefer the comics that has over the top stuff in it. To me not having the Hulk battle the Leader, the Abomination, giant battles with the military, take those away, its not the Hulk anymore, its just Hulk-lite. It would be very hard to care about a Hulk TV show without those elements in it, to me they are pretty important. I think its easier to have an sense that Hulk is being pursued and can't. You can't do Planet Hulk or any story with the Maestro, they are important Hulk stories and if you can't have TV shows adapt a lot of these important stories, I don't think I would care about it.

If they made a novel series and couldn't put certain characters in it because it be too expensive, then I wouldn't want to be adapted in the first place.

You might like a paired down Hulk story, I don't think I would, I just can't make that many compromises just get something on TV. It have to amazing writing, the best of HBO level writing, to like a Hulk TV show that is missing a lot of the key elements from the comics.

Christopher wrote: View Post
I want the character stuff and the fantastical elements, if a TV show can't deliver that, then I don't care about it.
But you don't need special effects to do fantasy. A lot of good fantasy stories have been told simply through ideas and situations. You know why the original Star Trek had so many stories about telekinetics and godlike beings? Because it doesn't cost much money to have one actor hold out his hand and another pretend to be thrown across the room or strangled or rendered unable to speak. The story about Captain Kirk being split into two people? Sure, there were a few split-screen shots, but mostly the story was told through discussion and character interaction, the "effect" of the split conveyed through performance. SF and fantasy are about ideas, not just spectacle.
Except Star Trek was made for TV, comic books are not. Maestro, Abomination, the Leader and his over the top mad science is harder to do then most of the stuff on Star Trek, because Star Trek is made with a TV budget in mind.

If Star Trek had to cut out characters to work in another adaption, wouldn't that mean that something is missing in the adaption? Likewise if characters like Abomantion, the Leader, Maestro, etc can't work in a TV series, doesn't that mean missing is missing, a big something, if you grew up reading about them? Its not just spectacle, its leaving out characters and plot points that I think are key.

Christopher wrote: View Post
Perhaps, but another problem with the Lee film was that it overdid the visual spectacle, with the overly literal comic-panel effects that were a constant distraction and just too cutesy for the film's own good. More FX doesn't automatically equal a better story.
Well I liked the second Hulk movie, it had some spectacle, but it was more fun and closer to the comics.



Christopher wrote: View Post
At first the network didn't allow any supervillains at all; it wasn't until the second half of the season that the producers were given the freedom to use them. And Mark Hamill's Trickster is very well regarded; it was the prototype for his Joker from Batman: TAS (and Corinne Bohrer's Prank from the season finale may have been a prototype Harley Quinn of sorts).
But that was just one or two episodes? Most of the Flash TV show was just bland, I bought the DVD of the show and I think the show was pretty dull. It was not a very good show and that is why it was cancelled after a season what do you think makes it a quality program?

The problem I have not liked most of the live action super hero TV shows, so that is why I don't care about the TV shows compared the movies. To me, the movies are almost always closer to the comics then the TV shows are, the two Donner movies were closer to the Superman comics then Smallville was and that is what matters to me. The movies are better at honoring the spirit of the comic books then the TV sows have been. The TV shows are almost always inferior adaptions to the movies, which is why I don't care about DC making more live action TV shows then Marvel, because I have not liked most of them. I would rather see a Flash or Wonder Woman movie, then another attempt to give them a TV show, considering I didn't really care for the last Flash TV show and saw that Wonder Woman pilot.

Christopher wrote: View Post
Lets not get into the bad production values of Birds of Prey.
Which was on the same network as Smallville and thus, again, had a much smaller budget to work with than a show on ABC or FOX would have. It's nonsense to make a blanket generalization about all TV based on those examples.
Okay, but how many TV live action didn't have to leave things out or change things just to meet a TV budget? How many super hero TV shows have had great production values? That is the problem is corners have to be cut to meet the TV budget and thus often loses the vision that original comic book had. Again that is why I had problems with Smoke Demon Darkseid, Mikhail Mxyzptlk and the meteor freaks, they don't make the story better, they just make it worse, they are less interesting than stuff in the comics.

Christopher wrote: View Post
Although I recenty rewatched BoP, and I didn't have much problem with the production values. Their digital cityscape of New Gotham was very impressive for the day. True, the production had a very stagey, artificial feel, but that was evidently intentional, since this was pre-Nolan and the show took its design and visual cues from the fanciful Burton and Schumacher films.
Well I didn't like the production values in that show.

Christopher wrote: View Post
We don't live in Japan, they have more a boarder spectrum of animation then we do. Maybe the animation age ghetto will change in the future, kids animation seems to get away with more now then when I was a kid, but its here for now.
But by now, we should have people who grew up on B:TAS and Gargoyles and the like becoming decision-makers in the industry. So they should know better than to assume animation is just for kids. This should already be the future in which that's starting to change.
That is just not case. I will say one thing, for the past 20 years DC has made way better animation.

Last edited by The Overlord; April 10 2013 at 05:16 AM.
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