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Old March 30 2013, 05:39 PM   #206
yousirname's Avatar
Re: Roddenberry's Worst Ideas

T'Girl wrote: View Post
The sequence of events would have been more difficult for Kirk, but the result would have been the same.
You're not hearing me. You offer an interpretation of Kirk's words such that he's referring to physical currency only. My point is that his words make no sense if interpreted in that way. They need to get some money, be it physical or otherwise. If physical currency were obsolete in 1986, Kirk and company would still need to get some money, wouldn't they? So it makes no sense for Kirk to be referring to physical currency. His statement is a non-sequitur. Whereas if he's referring to money in general, his statement makes perfect sense.

In the scene you're referring to, Nog specifically said Humanity gave up currency. Interestingly, Nog didn't say the Federation as a whole had. Jake at no point said there was no money, only that he didn't need it, which was false.
"It's not my fault that your species decided to abandon currency-based economics in favor of some philosophy of self-enhancement."

If "currency" refers solely to physical money, then "currency-based economics" isn't a thing. The phrase doesn't mean anything. Nor does the adoption of 'a philosophy of self-enhancement' suggest itself as standing in contrast to the use of physical currency. Again, your interpretation renders the statement meaningless.

Now only a few episodes before, Jake personally engaged in a business transaction that resulted in Jake acquiring ... currency (GPL).
And he also 'sells' his first article, and receives no payment. Again, irretrievably self-contradictory.

Given that people in the 23rd/24th centuries still get sick, doesn't it automatically follow that they also still "need money?"
No. If I tell you that the sky is green and that two and two make four, given that the sky is not green, does it follow that two and two don't make four? Wesley Crusher remarks on the common cold as 'something humans used to get' so we can assume without any real reaching that that's the order of 'sickness' Soong is referring to. But certainly he's not referring to physical currency only.

It is true that people in the past had physical currency.
Yes, it's true. But it makes absolutely no sense to interpret Soong's words in that way. Yet again your interpretation bids us regard the characters as speaking nonsense.

Pretty consistent really, there are dozens and dozens of pieces of dialog about buying, selling, owning inside of the Federation. There is only one single line, in one movie, where one character overtly states money doesn't exist.
No, there are also numerous lines which only make sense if interpreted in that way. To interpret them your way requires us to believe characters are saying things for no reason or saying things which are meaningless ("currency-based economics").

Ronald D. Moore wrote:
By the time I joined TNG, Gene had decreed that money most emphatically did NOT exist in the Federation, nor did 'credits' and that was that. Personally, I've always felt this was a bunch of hooey, but it was one of the rules and that's that.
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