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Old February 18 2013, 06:30 PM   #190
Vice Admiral
Location: in a figment of a mediocre mind's imagination
Re: My "Just Saw Insurrection For the First Time" Review.

Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post
sonak wrote: View Post
Robert Maxwell wrote: View Post

You haven't picked anything apart. You've started out with your position that the good of the many outweighs the wishes of the few, and you have shaped your arguments around that. You've started with a foregone conclusion and then tried to work your way to justifying it. My approach is more legalistic, in which definitions matter, jurisdiction matters, and the Federation's own supposed values should be taken into account.

It is "a planet within Federation space." It is absolutely not a member of the Federation. That Picard makes this distinction is apparently important. The Federation is not free to do as they please with the planet and its inhabitants, because it is not a "Federation planet." That is an entirely separate point from whether the Federation should protect the Ba'ku from the Son'a. The Federation may not want known Dominion allies poking around in their backyard, and they may not be keen on watching a massacre happen that they could've easily prevented. The Federation would have no legal obligation to protect people who aren't Federation members, but it'd still be kinda shitty for them to stand by and watch a massacre happen in their own territory.

What they absolutely should not have done is get in bed with Son'a and try to surreptitiously move the Ba'ku in order to harvest the metaphasic radiation. Doing this to a group of people without their informed consent--indeed, without even warning them you are going to do it, and with intent to actively deceive them when you do it--is simply wrong.

I didn't realize that you were only claiming that the Federation had a "moral" claim to help the Baku, not a legal one. If that's the case, it's just silly. The Federation, with its "values," has been willing to let billions die for the Prime Directive. Why would their "values" dictate that they should help a small group of selfish villagers in a civil war over a planet that the Son'a have just as much claim to? Heck, PICARD himself calls it a "blood feud."
I have said more than once that the Federation should protect the Ba'ku if the Ba'ku ask for help. Kind of hard for the Federation to do anything if they don't even know it's going on.

Blood feud or not, standing by and watching a bunch of drug- and slave-trafficking bandits wipe out a colony of (apparently) defenseless people sounds like the kind of thing the Federation wouldn't generally turn a blind eye to--at least not within their own territory.

I guess we disagree then. The Federation has stood by and watched a lot worse things happen, I see no reason why they'd want to get involved here, especially if they could benefit a lot more from a Son'a victory(with the particles) than they would from helping the Baku. Getting involved in what is essentially the very definition of a civil war in a way that leads to a DISADVANTAGE for the Federation(they make an outright enemy out of the Son'a, while gaining a much weaker pacifist, isolationist "ally," and they lose out on the particles)makes absolutely no sense from any perspective.
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