Thread: After Romulus
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Old January 10 2013, 07:36 AM   #98
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Re: After Romulus

Christopher wrote: View Post

But since we're unlikely to see any more canonical depictions of the Prime universe post-2387, that leaves it up to the tie-ins to determine how things go. And my point is that there's nothing to prevent Pocket or IDW from establishing that the Romulan people still endure after Hobus. Indeed, as Markonian just pointed out, Star Trek Online has already done so -- in their continuity, the supernova threw the empire into turmoil and triggered civil war and political strife for quite some time thereafter, but the RSE still exists in 2409 as a major galactic power and there are still plenty of Romulans around. I see no reason why the novels wouldn't take a similar route, especially since that would be in keeping with how the novels have already depicted the RSE to date. The scenario of a post-Hobus reality where the Romulan culture is extinct just doesn't seem like something we're ever likely to see in any professionally created work.
But why would you WANT to do something that's already been done? Wouldn't it be more interesting to see differing outcomes? Don't let other interpretations of the movie events tie you down. Surely there must be more than one way (or two or twenty) that things could progress.

rfmcdpei wrote: View Post
RPJOB wrote: View Post
Going strictly by what we've seen in the shows Romulus has had very few colonies mentioned. I imagine that Romulus is seen as being the promised land due to it being the world chosen by their ancestors. It's possible that most of the other inhabited planets have a small Romulan presence, mostly military overseers using the indigenous population as slave labor.
It's possible, but it's not likely.

* The Romulans seem to be as expansionistic a culture as any other. To assume that Romulans didn't colonize new territories when they became available would be to have them behave in a way that no human imperialist power has ever behaved. The novelverse has further established that there are multiple sizable Romulan colonies, the Praetor herself being from one (Glintara). Romulan colonies may plausibly not have been mentioned in the various series because non-Romulans didn't have access to the Romulan colonies; the Romulans are, after all, isolationists.

* It's very likely that the Romulans would take over inhabited worlds and establish themselves as ruling classes. That's what imperialist societies do. The novels even explicitly establish them as doing that with the Kevratans, while Terix II--a major Romulan world--also has its own indigenous population. The Romulans are almost certainly minorities on many worlds in their empire.

Given these are planets with populations possibly amounting to the billions, this is still a sizable number. For comparison, in South Africa immediately after apartheid of the forty-odd million South Africans only five million were white. South African whites still are more numerous than, say, New Zealanders or Uruguayans, and they controlled a technologically and economically sophisticated state. Apartheid ended in South Africa as peacefully as it did only because whites were convinced to do so. I really don't see Romulans on these Romulan-minority worlds as being nicer.

Also, the Hobus supernova wouldn't have destroyed just Romulus but everything in between as well as in other directions. It's an expanding sphere. Spock may have used the red matter to stop it from entering Federation space. The rest of the RSE may be essentially depopulated.
The novelverse draws upon Star Trek: Star Charts, which shows the Romulan Star Empire to be a pretty large ellipse of space that at points comes quite close to the Federation core, the novels further establishing the existence of large Romulan population on worlds fairly distant from Romulus--Achernar, Devoras, and Rator all come to mind. If the Hobus supernova really was so big as to annihilate all these Romulan worlds, then the Federation core worlds would also be destroyed.

The Wormhole wrote: View Post
All that considered, I'm sure there are still other Romulans around, including a colony world or two. Certainly the days of the Romulans being one of the quadrant's biggest political entities are over, but the Romulan species is still around, even if there are very few left.
There's still going to be large numbers of Romulans around. Even if the Hobus supernova destroys some older Romulan colony worlds, the Romulans have spread out sufficiently that I can't see Romulan civilization as being doomed by the destruction of the homeworld.

(Will the destruction of the Romulans encourage the survivors to consider new possibilities? Sure. They're just not going to be driven into extinction, that's all.)
Bolding in your post added by me. Note the word human. These are NOT humans. They're aliens. If they're going to act and react and respond just like humans they why even bother making them aliens?

I've been rereading Spock's Wold recently and there's a passage that talks about how very few Vulcans have ever left their planet, let alone their system. The number quoted was around 5% as opposed to about an average of 40% for other races. Romulans are basically Vulcans under the skin. Their ancestors left Vulcan and deliberately chose a new homeworld, most likely bypassing other suitable planets seeing how common class M worlds are. Something about Romulus caused them to choose it. If they're the same homebodies as Vulcans are in Spock's World then they may not WANT to live elsewhere. Getting posted to another planet may be considered a punishment. Alternately, the Government, though the Tal Shiar, may not want distant colonies to grow too large. Large colonies breed dangerous ideas like freedom and independence. Keeping the populations low and transient keeps these ideas from taking root.

Klingons relish struggle. Romulans want control.

rfmcdpei wrote: View Post
JD wrote: View Post
If Romulans are really as powerful politically as we are repeated told in the different stories, then I would image they would have to have quite a few colonies out there with a lot of Romulans on them. Not to mention all of the Romulan ships that were probably out and about when the Hobus event happened. At this point I doubt they are in any danger as a species, but the Empire as a political entity is probably a different story. Since the supernova destroyed Romulus and it's star system, then that means the Empire has lost it's homeworld and the majority of it's political, and military leaders. So I have a feeling that whatever is left of the Empire as political and military entity is probably a lot weaker than what it was before.
I think the effect on the Empire might be akin to that of destroying the Eastern Seaboard of the United States but sparing the remainder of the country. The large majority of the Empire's population, productive capacity, and military remains intact, and when a new administration is installed it will resume its great power status, but for the time being it's going to be preoccupied with cultivating (rather, rebuilding) its own garden.
I see it more as destroying the British Isles at the height of the British Empire. There's ships and personnel spread across the globe but the vast majority of citizens, as opposed to colonial subjects, are suddeny gone.

Edit_XYZ wrote: View Post
Sci wrote: View Post
The Wormhole wrote: View Post

IMO, First Contact's bigger flaw is why do the Borg, who only really care about technology that can help them achieve perfection even bother to assimilate a planet the day before it achieves warp flight?
Answer: Because the Borg, contrary to Q's claims in TNG Season Two, clearly care about more than just their victims' technology. In particular, they seem obsessed with their inability to assimilate the Federation.
The borg sent all of 2 cubes (out of MILLIONS) to assimilate the federation up to 'first contact'. That's not even close to 'obsessed'.
7 of 9 confirms that the borg don't bother assimilating species having no relevant technology (kazon); they destroy them instead.
Or The Borg habe already tied time travel 26 times before but each time was via a method that led to a new universe splitting off like in ST09. In First Contact it's the first time they're using a method that changes the present as happened in City of the Edge of Forever. If the Enterprise hadn't been in the temporal wake then the Borg would have succeeded and nobody would have even known that it happened.
We can admit that we're killers ... but we're not going to kill today. That's all it takes! Knowing that we're not going to kill - today! - Kirk - A Taste of Armageddon
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