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Old January 3 2013, 01:25 PM   #15
Blip
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Re: Enterprise-C Bridge Layout

Timo wrote: View Post
This is true, but the DS9 coveralls were never intended or shown as being primarily for enlisted use -- and neither were the 'formal' TNG unis intended solely for officers.
And the result was that they weren't "primarily" used by anybody, and we are forced to accept that Starfleet intended them to be worn in a mixed manner.
No, that was the production intent. The DS9 unis were created specifically as part of the "rougher, tougher" edge-of-the-frontier feel of the show. It was not some sort of unintentional result as you infer.

But while the TOS movie coveralls had some offscreen intent behind them, this intent did not have any decisive onscreen result. It did not manage to establish that only enlisteds (and enlisted trainees, and perhaps cadets) could wear the coveralls, because how do you establish something like that? The audience might simply be failing to see those hundreds of officers who wear the thing, because they wear it outside the movies the audience sees and the camera records.
Let me get this straight: You refuted my comment on the original production intent (which is documented) on the basis that it was offscreen. And then you conjecture that hundreds of officers may be wearing enlisted jumpsuits offscreen, but we 'never saw them' to validate your viewpoint? Do you see what's wrong with that??

So the TOS movie intent really counts for nothing. Even ST2, which is supposed to introduce the whole uniform system, makes a mess of who is a cadet and who is not. Spock supposedly trains cadets, and Spock supposedly trains Saavik, but Saavik is never addressed as Cadet and wears the officer tunic with commissioned Lieutenant insignia. So, are the jumpsuit people the cadets? Peter Preston is addressed as Midshipman, but while wearing the (red-collared) heavy protective suit, and we never see him in a regular jumpsuit.

Timo Saloniemi
The generally accepted thought on this is that Saavik was a pre-graduated Lt, who if I'm not mistaken had returned to the Academy for command training. Why else do you think she was taking the Kobayashi Maru test?

The element of the uniform which denotes being a cadet is the bright red department undertunic, for both enlisted and officer cadets. Normal enlisted crewmembers wear a black undertunic, while officers of course have the appropriate dept colour.

Whether Preston has a regular jumpsuit or not is completely besides the point - he was in engineering, of course he had an environmental suit on! Again, you note he wears a red-collar engineering suit. This is because he's a cadet. Regular personnel feature a black collared suit.
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For those determined to contort yourselves into knots so as to include every minor production flub as gospel, and shoehorn it into "cannnonnnnn": STOP. I don't have all day to waste on here; I quite like enjoying real life thankyouverymuch.
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