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Old December 21 2012, 02:21 AM   #61
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Re: A country without Money how it's work?

Deks wrote: View Post
Merry Christmas wrote: View Post
You have to admit Deks, your repeated use of the phrase "relevant general education" is kind of ominous.

So, by suggesting to expand the awareness of the global population to include the latest scientific knowledge (among other things) and relevant information that would expand people's horizons is ominous?
Ominous because you seem to be connecting this "relevant general education" with the general public accepting this TVP idea. And yes that does sound like you are advocating a form of mass indoctrination. the populace will be told what to think, and what to accept. That being the culture that accompanies (and compliments) TVP.

The good thing is this likely wouldn't work on more than a small sized population group. People don't like being told what to think and do, especially if it's clearly a overt action on some agencies part. How could you switch over to this "special education" without it being obvious to just about everyone that you're pushing a small group's private agenda?

If American politicians and the school boards tried this stunt with the schools, they'd be out of office with the next election (or next special election). On the upside for your idea, it might have a measure of success in some of the totalitarian political states. But even there the chances of it working over time is slim.

Like at Russia under the communists (and I'm not saying you idea is communist), for decades the small controlling group attempted to eliminate religion in Russia. The communist would gather villagers at safe distance and literally dynamited the local churches while the villagers were made to watch. Religious leaders and teachers were sent to labor camps. But it didn't work, no matter how much oppression was applied. Religion went underground, continued to minister to the populace and they waited. In time the communists were gone, and the religion was still there.

The point isn't specifically about religion, it's about being between hard to impossible to get the majority of people to accept some silly idea that makes little sense.

This "relevant general education" you advocate, who's going to make the decision to start this?

Another one (of the many) problems with what you advocating is that not everyone want to be unemployed, and then be taken care of. And no Deks, it actually is not that they've been schooled to think that.

You're using that particular cliché way too often.

People naturally take pleasure and satisfaction in their own labors. People reach fulfillment in their occupations, they expend effort and experience a sense of accomplishment at the finished results. They did that, built that, produced that.

People obtain tremendous satisfaction and pride from what they do. Just within my own family in America, there are machinists who work for Boeing Aircraft, when a plane flies over, they can identify the type they personally worked on, and feel pride. My family in Brazil has been working the same farm land since the mid nineteenth century, wheat, corn, sugar and forage. Producing thousands of tonnes of food through the years. My uncle now owns three commercial fishing boas, hard work, but he loves working the sea.

These aren't meaningless hobbies that they undertake because they have too much time on their hands, it's an honest days work.


You also seem to have turned a blind eye to the fact that Human Beings are not socially and culturally homogeneous. Our histories and heritages have produced hundred of major, and thousands of minor, ethic groups. All of whom have slightly different views on what composes a well thought out society, community and nation.

Unless your "education system" is going to eliminate that.


The idea of a circular community plan reminds me of the story of the Brazilian city of Goiânia. The plan was for a city with the shape of a circle, multiple concentric radius's with streets in the form of spokes, the seats of the state and municipal government in the center. The design was for about 50,000 people. The planned city was founded in 1933.

Problem with "planning" is this, the city grew to be 1.3 million people, and "the plan" grew with the city. At a certain point the populace began to disagree with "the plan," and in typical Brazilian fashion began to build however they saw fit. Growth was pure laissez-faire. People purchased the industrial section and put up high rises. People wanted neighborhood clinics, not giant central hospitals. People built houses where they weren't supposed to, so they could walk to work. Public transit is nice, but the city has one of the highest ratios of cars to people in all of Brazil.

Nothing automatically wrong with a planned community, as long as you can adapt (i.e. junk) the plan for the people who will actually live there.

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