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Old December 18 2012, 10:03 PM   #32
Locutus of Bored
My Force Isn't Awake Yet
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Location: Huntington Beach, California
Re: Is Zom-poc/post-apoc the genre for misanthropes?

Ian Keldon wrote: View Post
HoHoHocutus wrote: View Post
You have suggested that people are immoral for liking certain genre characters,
To the point of dressing like them and emulating them when they are villain characters of a particularly vile type, yes.
Their emulation generally stops at harmless role-playing, though. Take the 501st Legion guys which you criticized for dressing up as Stormtroopers and other Star Wars villains. When they're not role-playing or making appearances at conventions and other events, they raise $11.8 million dollars (in 2011) for charity with public appearances and auctions. Yet to listen to you, we should treat them as a fifth column secretly trying to undermine the country with their Stormtrooper/Nazi ways. A lot of their appearances involve performing for kids, who it turns out like the cool uniforms and stuff and aren't secretly sympathetic with genocide, just as all the kids in the 70s and 80s who thought Darth Vader, Boba Fett, and Stormtroopers were cool didn't grow up and aspire to torture princesses, cut off their children's appendages, and blow up the planet.

The fact that you can't tell the difference between role-play of fictional characters and admiration or active emulation of real life genocidal thugs (as opposed to just wargaming or playing Call of Duty), or notice the clear inaccuracy of your premise based on the lack of Nazi-like Star Wars fans running around every convention gunning people down indicates the flaw lies on your end, and not with everyone who disagrees with you.

Go read some of the stuff that gets said on some of the hard-core prepper sites. They'll outright TELL you that they'd be perfectly happy for 99% of the world's population to die because in the preppers' opinion they don't deserve to live.
And what percentage of zombie/post-apocalyptic story fans do you think that actually represents? It's a fringe group. The vast majority of people who enjoy zombie and post-apocalyptic fiction go to work and go about the rest of their day not constantly anticipating the end of the world just like most other people.

I'll grant that there's likely a greater crossover between the two groups than there is among the general population, but that's mostly because people who are doomsday preppers and survivalists or the even rarer bunch who look forward to the end of the world (which is easy to do when you're currently living in relative luxury vs. the actual experience) would be attracted to that kind of fiction, not because the fiction itself made them that way.

There are probably some people who got into survivalism because of reading or watching post-apocalyptic or zombie fiction, but that's not likely a large percentage of the total fandom, and the amount who actually want to see it come true because of what they've read (as opposed to just talking a big game about how well they'd survive such an event online) is probably infinitesimal.

I am perfectly aware of the difference between fiction and real life, just as you are perfectly aware of the point I was actually making that you just didn't want to address: that it is morally repugnant to declare yourself a fan of an organization, real OR fictional, that commits or committed heinously barbaric acts and crimes against humanity (or sentient life in the case of SW).

And yes, stormtroopers DID do those things in the service of the Imperial military, which had well-known codes for committing planetary-scale genocide (Base Delta Zero), and which built Death Stars to make it even EASIER to commit planetary-scale genocide.

No sane, moral person would ever dress up as a Nazi and proclaim themselves "fans" of those evil people, nor would any sane, moral person ever dress up as an Imperial Stormtrooper and declare themselves "fans" of those evil people. Justifying it as "it's just fiction" is no excuse.
You say you're perfectly aware of the difference between fiction and reality, yet contradict yourself within the same paragraph and the ones that followed.

Again, why aren't Darth Vader and Stormtrooper fans out murdering people left and right as we speak? They're either insane and have no control over their actions or they're amoral and have no concern for the consequences of their actions on others, so if your premise is right, they must be out committing crimes constantly. Yet, I don't see a lot of news stories about guys in Stormtrooper gear murdering short hairy people they thought looked sort of Ewok-ey or serial killers in Darth Vader costumes killing local psychics and monks in their own Jedi Purge. And on the rare occasion you do see someone in a Vader costume committing a crime, it usually gets widespread attention in the weird news segment or section because it's an absurd novelty, not a commonplace occurrence.

Since we're in making baseless snap judgments of fans of certain genres of fiction mode, what shall we make of your love of anthropomorphic cats as symbolized by your ThunderCats avatar? Are you a fan of yiffing? Does Mr. Whiskers need to show us on the doll where he was touched? No sane, moral person would ever fantasize about humanoid cats.

(Note to J. Allen, Gep, and Chem: I'm just making a smartass point there, so don't get all uppity ).

Hey, didn't the ThunderCats homeworld of Thundera get destroyed? Now that I think about it, didn't your old Transformers avatar revolve around a species of killer robots whose home planet was also destroyed in an endless war? Don't the "Autobots wage their battle to destroy the evil forces of the Decepticons." Since their "forces" are pretty much themselves, isn't that genocide? There's not many of them left on either side, yet they just keep on fighting to the brink of extinction. Why do you admire such behavior and wear symbols of genocidal robot warlords? Are you secretly looking forward to the end of the world since both the ThunderCats and Transformers continued fighting enemies here on Earth? Are you looking forward to the military's thousands of drones suddenly turning on their masters and exterminating us?

I've got my eye on you, you maniac in waiting. I'm not going to let you destroy this world like I know you want to.
- There are stories about what happened.
- It's true. All of it. TNZ, Hulk, ModMan. They're real.
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