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Old December 16 2012, 07:02 AM   #19
The Castellan
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Re: A country without Money how it's work?

Brainsucker wrote: View Post
Whorfin wrote: View Post
I think important points are that "we" probably means "Terra", possibly not all of the rest of its colonies, and certainly not all the hundreds or thousands of other cultures in Federation space (members, associates, protectorates, or not). Secondly, it may be a more recent development, as possibly contradictions may or may not apply from TOS depending upon the interpretation of dialogue.

The point that seems to be being made is not that there are no "value allocation units" (i.e., credits), but rather the culture and its material wealth have evolved to the point that greed has become an almost foreign concept, or at least largely an historical one. Supply has met and overcome demand in a basic sense. Acquisition of knowledge and the usefulness to society are more fulfilling than the accumulation of digits in an electronic account or bigger and better mansions (i.e., material wealth). This does not mean that members who are more useful to society don't get additional rewards (not everyone can have a flat in Paris, for example) but these rewards are awarded on the basis of some sort of (theoretically) unbiased assessment of value to society rather than commercial competitiveness (which is somewhat arbitrary and often exaggerated).

Just as the current system would seem bizarre to a 24th Century Terran, their (fictional) system is hard to understand from today's perspective. And discussion of it in the current zeitgeist will likely generate contributions from the 20th-21st Century's Culture Wars, and their inherent confusion of freedom, democracy, and capitalism (which would be OT).
Interesting. So it is only in Terra that the "No Money society" is happen. But I don't think that greed is already a foreign concept for human being. Because greed is one of basic human nature. Without Greed, they will stick on the planet Earth and won't explore the galaxy. Plus, if knowledge and the usefulness to society more fulfilling than the accumulation of digits in an electronic account or bigger and better mansions, then human is not evolving, but devolving. Because they evolve from a complex society into more simple society that care only two things in their life. Work for the society (without payment) and study.

and... how could capitalism be happen in a country without money? The Earth of UFP is definitely a communism type of society, if it's work like what you write. Capitalism is born from the greed of Human being. Without greed, no one will establish a private company. Because nobody want to become rich.

The Eggnogstic wrote: View Post
Here we go again!
Yeees, here I go again
I like how you think.

As for conspiracy theories... well, for one thing, we would be rather closed-minded to discredit the notion that such things are not possible... especially seeing how our history has examples of conspiracies that turned out to be accurate.
Plus... Humans seem to apply the notion of 'impossible' too often - this mainly stems from lack of exposure to relevant general education.
I think it's mainly because they don't WANT to accept the idea, you know it's like the ostrich in the sand thing.

Our history is FULL of events showing those in power don't always have our benefits and interests in mind, just their own. Governments and military have always wanted to take away more rights, freedom and privacy from their people, and use theoretical security as the justification.....happened in Nazi Germany, happened in Communist Russia, happening now in China and America (Yes, it's happening in America as well)...and also groups have been made to allow/help those governments do just that. It's been around for a long time and if someone says it can't happen here, because "IT'S AMERICA!!!!!!" or "It's the 21st century!" or "It won't last that long, or they have a good reason to do it!" shows to me how historically IGNORANT some people, especially mainstreamers, can be. Plus the word conspiracy and conspiracy theorist should not be looked upon with disgust or ridicule, most people that attack them or their suggestions often fear they might actually be right, and naysayers often fight harder to stop them if the theorists are correct. for 9-11, for example, Jesse Ventura brought up on interviews, "why should we all go "How dare you?!" if someone questions things like 9-11 and so on?" We're supposed to learn by asking questions and not just take it unquestionably.

Notion of impossibility is not so much as educational, as more emotional, that something long ridiculed may actually be the right answer. Or that they simply don't like the theory or don't want to be proven wrong, or possibly lose their position in life. Like if Tesla's work was not destroyed by that asshole, JP Morgan, and to a lesser extent, Thomas Edison, we could not only have escaped the oil trap, but maybe be possibly a century more advanced in technology....plus I've read so many news articles of alternative energy scientists and researchers found dead....all labeled as 'suicides'.....I already smell a rat, there, since I refuse to believe that THAT many alternative energy scientists are THAT depressed. Plus with the middle east.....our government pretty much helped these guys get in power decades ago, and also a vain of lithium has been discovered recently, worth about a trillion bucks.....and they say it's NOT because of wealth and resources. And I nearly got expelled from school when arguing with a science teacher after he threw away my scientific notes I made regarding both abiotic oil theory, that its not organic based and not finite, plus some stuff that would knock newton and einstein's work down a few pegs....but he would not even let me discuss it....and boy did we have a fight in class.....become a class hero and made that old fart teacher eat a little bit of long over due crow. Hell, there was one guy on this forum who said guys like Eric Van Daniken, a proponent of Ancient Alien theory, be prosecuted for the theories he's been circulating. Not only does that reek of the mentality from the dark ages, with a dash of Gestapo thrown in, but also intolerance to anything that questions the conventional. Seems people, authority figures especially, would rather be correct than happy.

You get a cookie....oh hell, a box of cookies, friend.


With money....to me money is only a means to an end, when it becomes the end itself, there's a big problem, and that problem is happening now. Also, I live in a small, rural, farming community....and when one of us is in a jam, we help each other out, not asking for anything in return. I also help folks with problems, not asking for anything. I give advise or lend a hand if asked, not asking for anything, except where the bathroom is and MAYBE a glass of water. And if we want our future to be more like Trek and less like Mad Max or most humanity in Dr. Who, money's priority needs big time adjustments, and we'll never achieve anything real if we're only busting our butts to pay the bills and taxes.
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