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Old November 16 2012, 08:47 AM   #345
sojourner
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Re: Envisioning the world of 2100

gturner wrote: View Post

And none of the missiles of the period were capable of attaining orbit either, X-15 contemporaries excepted, and I can't recall the last time an RPG went orbital due to it's lack of wings, even when aimed at the sky over Mogadishu.
And? none of the cars of the period or the boats or the hand grenades were capable of orbit as well. They weren't designed to. neither were those tanks you mentioned. So, not sure how that makes your point that it can be done.
None of the reasons the X planes didn't achieve orbit have anything to do with the the orientation of the fuel container.
but it has everything to do with the size of the fuel container. Not enough fuel, no orbit. Try to build a tank big enough and strong enough to ly on it's side fully loaded AND deal with the stress of a vertical liftoff and you have 2 outcomes. a vehicle that splits in half or a vehicle that doesn't have the mass fraction to achieve orbit. Because>>>>
There are rocket equations that tell you these things.



You can lift anything with a rocket. The Saturn V is an example of lifting something big with a rocket, and it was lifted from the ground.
not while on it's side
So yes, I think it was possible to lift something as large as a Saturn V using rockets.
on it's side?
You obviously do not.
not while on it's side and especially not if it's to complete it's designed purpose
We'll just have to disagree on the reality of the moon landings.
Does that mean you think they were hoaxed?


Solids are very precise, because they're used in a control loop with feedback. Liquids are somewhat more precise, but only somewhat. You can gimbal the thrust of both
ah, a moment of truth
, and you can measure the thrust of both, and you can terminate the thrust of both.
seriously? I'd like to see you terminate the thrust of a solid before it runs out
You only need the throttle control if you can't predetermine how much thrust you'll need, which is not the case during a launch, otherwise we'd have never launched a single Space Shuttle mission.

Keep in mind that you're arguing that small solids are useless for a 20 second imprecise launch application while advocating that we build entire launch systems to rely on them for precision performance, such as the Shuttle, SLS, and Delta IV.
I said no such thing. I said solids were brutishly powerful and used early when they could be corrected for. IIR you advocated liquid engines for the first 20 seconds of flight, not solids. watch those goal posts

So, the Air Force has never eyed orbit. It's just completely beyond their radar. They've also never flown the X-1, X-1A, X-2, or X-15, and they never had programs called Dyna Soar, Blue Gemini, and a host of others, the latest being the X-37B, which never went into orbit,
remind me which one of those successfully took off vertically while in a horizontal position?
despite all the lies perpetuated by the same media that claimed the moon landings were real, even though it's impossible to launch a Saturn V from the ground.

Ironically, the director of that program is working with Stratolaunch, apparently consulting with the engineer privy to the secret Peenemunde documents on horizontal fuel tanks.
Ah, hey conspiracy whack jobbery always entertaining for a few laughs.

Hmmm, I was gonna comment on your "came up with an idea that improved a conjectural LEM design", but you seem to have retracted it. Oh wait, here it is:
So yes, compared to you, I am certainly a genius, which is probably why the re-configurations of a lunar lander I did yesterday got picked up on some blogs as shaving weight, mass, and complexity, boosting redundancy, reducing weight, decreasing the complexity, lowering the center of mass, adding partial re-usability, all in a few simple changes on how they should exit, leading to a cascade of benefits.
POST PROOF OR RETRACT. Oh, that's right, you already did. nevermind.

And on that note, good night.
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