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Old September 29 2012, 06:15 AM   #169
Spock/Uhura Fan
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Re: Who likes Spock/Uhura too?

UFO wrote: View Post
No, I believe they are matters of probability only. I was going by what we have every reason to expect of the Spock character from what we see in TOS. I have explained my reasons for preferring Spock to remain true to that character...
I didn't read your post at first and, having had the time to do so now, there are so many things I could respond to, but I'll just pick a choice few like the comment above.

That's just it, UFO. That character doesn't exist in this timeline. And as you yourself pointed out, when an older Spock (i.e. "that character") from the original timeline appears in this film, even the Prime Spock that you knew had changed some because of time and circumstance. Change a part of life.

Having the freedom to explore what Spock (and others) would have been like if certain events, or what have you, changed was the whole point of a "reboot." You're going to get *some* of what you knew from this character previously, but not everything. You appear to be saying that you understand this, but then you'll say something else that proves that you don't, at least not completely.

I understand people are set in their ways, but can we all just agree that these characters are not going to be carbon-copies of the originals, even if some of us don't like it? If they wanted him to "remain true" to that character, then they wouldn't have gone through the trouble of changing events that "alter" the timeline, therefore creating new circumstances and "changed" characters. To expect him to be the same makes absolutely no sense after seeing the film. I can understand expecting the same thing you saw before if you just walked into the movie blind, but after watching it and seeing that the creators of this new "version" of Star Trek had something different in mind, to just keep "expecting" them to do the same thing is beyond me. I hope that's not what you're asking for because that would be boring in my mind. Haven't you already seen that?

... In particular they explain why I think nuSpock is far less likely to be "available" for a relationship with Uhura or any other woman.
And after watching the 2009 film, I would say that with the loss of his mother being so immediate and unexpected, it would be more likely that he would desire and be "available" (as far as needs go) for a relationship with Uhura or some other human woman even if he hadn't already been seeing her. There is the destruction of Vulcan, and like new Spock said, it's logical for him to help replenish the Vulcan population. That's where the Spock you've seen in TOS comes into play. Like the great old man said, "You can be in two places at once." He essentially freed new Spock of his "logical" burden, or obligation, to help his fellow Vulcans in that way.

Getting back to the loss of his mother, now, most of my background here is from fanfiction (I've seen some episodes and a few movies with my mother), so you'll have to tell me what's real and what's made-up, but don't Vulcans have telepathic connections to those they are close to? If this is the case, at least the way I read it, then the loss of his mother would be tremendous because he could literally "feel" her presence (in a manner of speaking) everywhere he went. If what I read was correct, then he didn't just see her being taken from him and have to deal with the impact of that, he also "felt" her being taken from him. A presence that was always there his entire life was just gone in an instant. Missing that "human touch" could cause him to desire a bond with Uhura, who he was already in love with, which would help him stable himself emotionally (even if he can wear a poker face) while he gets used to dealing with the hole left behind from that loss. When I read about their telepathic links, it just made me have a better appreciation for that scene in the movie where the Prime Spock that you know explains to new Kirk that he is (as well as the other "he") emotionally compromised.

After the meld, Kirk, who's not used to displaying an ever-present poker face, is our visual of what the Spocks are feeling on the inside, and he's so overwhelmed by the loss he literally had to catch his breath. Now, I know that some of the emotion might be different because Prime Spock might have felt some sorrow or guilt even (logic aside) because he couldn't get there in time to save the Romulans, but whatever he does feel about that (I'd imagine) new Spock felt anger in equal parts. He didn't know that guy, never met him, never promised him anything, but much of everything was taken from him by this crazed man from another time. So, Kirk obviously didn't feel the anger, but everything he did feel, he felt very deeply. I'm guessing the sense of loss is part of that. Such a major loss like that early in life can really change a person's outlook, especially when they've got another version of themselves to "free" them up from being logical in this regard so they can pursue what they actually might like. And as T'Pol says (I'm watching Ent right now), "like" is an emotion. That's just my view; I understand that you might feel differently.

You mentioned something about him being more "Vulcanized" because he's younger and spent most of his life with them, but 1) he'd been around humans for a few years when we were introduced the the "new Spock" and 2) More importantly, when he left the VSA after rejecting them, he didn't seem too keen on maintaining a purely Vulcan lifestyle as he headed to Earth to join Starfleet and the "humans."

But, as mentioned above, Spock/Uhura is a different story. Other people may only be concerned with whether they like Spock and Uhura together. They may put believability in terms of TOS consistency, aside. I just donít agree itís a good idea to do that on this occasion.
I guess this is the crux of where we disagree because that precisly was the idea when they made a reboot in an alternate timeline, and consequently it is the fact. It's not my idea, good or bad (I think it's great), but rather what was in the film. Consistency was "set aside" as soon as they "changed" the timeline and therefore the characters. Expecting this younger, somewhat different, version of Spock to be "consistent" with his counterpart in TOS is exactly what I was talking about in my first response to you above. You seem to say that you get they are not the same, but then you "expect" them to be just that. They'll have some things in common, even exact, but they won't be consistently the same.

On to more pictures. This one's for Greg Cox:

I couldn't find Zoe with any women, so this will have to suffice in keeping the fantasy alive, lol.
MA'AM. Hot damn, I can dig it.

ďThe history of men's opposition to women's emancipation is more interesting perhaps than the story of that emancipation itself.Ē - Virginia Woolf
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