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Old April 28 2012, 01:57 AM   #107
Violet.Phoenix
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Re: Play matchmaker for Janeway

teacake wrote: View Post
Violet.Phoenix wrote: View Post
teacake wrote: View Post
One thing I got out of the Sullivan relationship is that we actually see what Janeway wants because she programs him. I think its very significant that she says "make him more provocative". Chakotay is really lacking that, it's not a word you'd ever use to describe him. Perhaps if he had been less passive Janeway would have found her resolve to put her Captaincy first a little more challenged.
I agree, Chakotay was just... there a lot of the time. Even when he challenged Janeway she usually won out in the end. You have to wonder if he had had a little more 'oomph' in his personality if things would have gone differently.
The whole Angry Warrior story translated to "I am passive, you are in charge." The first time I saw it I was like.. wth, that's not what she wants in a man. I think that's part of why she values 7 because 7 is provocative. Of course she's way over the top but because of her background Janeway can give her leeway she would never allow if it was, say, Paris speaking to her like that.

The other problem with the Angry Warrior story is.. when is Chakotay ever angry? He didn't even have much of a reaction to the Seska betrayal.. he could have had a huge enraged scene over that. Now if he had told a Peaceful Warrior story it would have made more sense. Yes apparently he found peace as Janeways manservant at the end of the story but it's not like we see an angry past anywhere in his nature.

He's the sort of guy that a woman kind of looks over the shoulder of to find someone more exciting and then wakes up after some years and men have passed and realizes how compatible they really are. I thought it completely believable that they ended up together in the books (and a giant Fuck You to the fans that they immediately killed her after one night).

If Chakotay had been provocative angry maquis warrior with a spiritual side I'd be a total J/C'er. And yet I'm glad too that Voyager isn't a romance but about a leader finding a way home for her people.
That's very true about 7, also true about Paris because he can be rather snarky. I've always found that with Janeway and Paris is that they make great verbal sparring partners, because they've both got guts (and they make great character foils for eachother).

To me J/C made sense because they built it up, but it's not without it's flaws. I totally agree that making Chakotay less passive would have made the J/C relationship way more interesting. Imagine the intense discussions they would have had.

Oh the books. I'm still bitter over that giant 'fuck you' moment where KJ was killed off, and I probably will be bitter until she is back, alive and happily with Chakotay. With the whole 'one night together' thing, I view it as 'well at least we got some J/C', but I'm still not happy that they put Chakotay through that. The poor guy was almost destroyed by Janeway's death!
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