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Old February 22 2009, 08:17 AM   #11
JNG
Chief of Staff, Starfleet Command
 
Re: Sovereign Class and Photon Torpedoes

DRACO wrote: View Post


nothing to back that up?

how about....

1. the Galaxy class, whole families including children, the Soverign carries only officers and people need for specific missions
The ship splits in two. There's a battle section. If they wanted the other section to be in the fight also, they could probably, you know, offload noncombat personnel. I assume they did this for all the Galaxy-class ships we saw fighting in the war.

I also want to note that they didn't seem to hesitate sending the Enterprise-D into dangerous combat situations, despite the presence of families and such, and I don't think there is much evidence to suggest they impede combat performance in and of themselves.

DRACO wrote: View Post
2. the Galaxy class has numerous accommodations and far more diplomatic resources than the Sovy, why the Sovy has diplomatic potential is is far less than than the Galaxy lass, and the Sovy is not as spacious
Yes, I'm sure the diplomats are very cramped, finding anywhere to meet on a ship nearly two and a half million cubic meters in volume. I imagine there isn't even a place for them to have diplomatic receptions LIKE THE ONE THEY HAD IN INSURRECTION WHEN THEY WERE ON A DIPLOMATIC MISSION

DRACO wrote: View Post
3. the Sovy has type XII phasers and regenerative shielding, because of the immense power drain to offense and defensive systems, a new warp core was desiggned to add more power, type XII phasers, previously designated type X+ for security reasons where so power intensive that they where only used on outposts,stations and planetary defenses...
X+ would, I expect, be equivalent to Type-11, like DS9 got; you're using Technical Manual talk here, but the Tech Manual put those at the top of the scale. Type XII is just fanwank. Fanwank has its place, but do I think a ship designed a number of years before the DS9 upgrades has phasers bigger than what starbases were being fitted with at the time of her design? What sense does that make? What's "new" about the warp core?

DRACO wrote: View Post
4. the Sovy is much more manueverable than the Glaxy, a feature that has little benefit other than combat effectiveness
She very well may be; I don't know why you'd feel so sure about this. Impulse maneuverability probably isn't vastly important for a target nearly 700 meters long; it isn't as if there is a tremendous amount of dodging about she can do versus phaser beams or torpedoes and so forth that travel at c or greater. I'm sure it's always desirable, even for ships that will never fire a shot in anger.

DRACO wrote: View Post
5. Sources have stated that the Sovy, the Promethius and Akira where wall designs Starfleet put into production to combat the Borg threat as well as possible hostilities from the maor quadrant powers
Those sources (who? not an episode or movie, that's for sure) are not checking the timeline. The registry and design cues of the only known Akira-class starships place them before contact with the Borg was ever established. Enterprise-E was in space by 2372, probably in testing 2370-2371; even if she was only the second of her class, which she might not be, the U.S.S. Sovereign as a class ship could have taken DECADES to design and build, as the Technical Manual tells us the Galaxy did. Now if you're claiming Sovereign-class ships are such RADICAL advances on ships from only a few years earlier, then I'd expect the project to have taken at LEAST as long...but even if it took only an optimistic ten years, this is well before the Borg encounter in "Q Who?" (2367, I believe).

It would be a silly claim that Sovereign was thrown together in just a few years, like Defiant...but is huge, complex, a major advancement beyond ships of only a few years before, and doesn't suffer from severe flaws, unlike Defiant.

On the other hand, it is nearly a certainty that the Galaxy-class was designed during the Cardassian Wars; perhaps both were.

DRACO wrote: View Post
6. the Sovy has 16 Type XII Phaser arrays 8 Torp launchers and one Turret capable of firing 4torps/sec, I mean come on, plus only ships who are expected to see allot of action quantums
The phaser coverage is similar to that of a Galaxy-class ship, I don't acknowledge the phasers are of a different type at all (John Eaves noted they were the same), and I see no reason to believe that the Galaxy-class ships fighting the war (and other kinds too) didn't receive as many Q-torps as were available--they were obviously expected to see a lot of action, considering they had wings built around them in the fleet actions on DS9.

7. is it wasn't expected to see war-like conditions why bother with regenerative shielding?
I believe you are thinking of the Prometheus prototype. I don't recall this being mentioned in any of the movies with the Enterprise-E. A check of Memory Alpha supports this.

We don't know what other kinds of ships have this tech, if any, or if it can be retrofitted. Since it was mentioned as a feature of a new prototype, it is likely a very new thing, and not necessarily found on ships that were designed years and years before that prototype.

DRACO wrote: View Post
as for other things, two ships out of the whole fleet, your gonna be lucky if you see them, if your refferring to the E,'s initial absense in FC, that was explained... Starfleet not sure about Picard after his assimilation
I'm not suggesting there aren't plenty of other duties that need attention during the Dominion War, or that those duties are in any way less important. I do object to the view of any Sovereign-class ship as a fanboyish uberwarship vastly outperforming the Galaxy class or any other for defensive duties; it at least needs to be considered that ships of the class were not shown fighting the war, Enterprise-E was shown on rather less dangerous duties in our glimpse of her during the war, and it is possible to conclude from the rare sightings that the Sovereign class was a very limited run or had problems or something.

DRACO wrote: View Post
as for Insurrection, I do believe that was after the dominion war
It was during the war, and not only that, but Picard complains about the Enterprise being asked to put out "one more brush fire," as if they'd been doing these sorts of missions for a while (kept largely out of the conflict).

DRACO wrote: View Post
now the Sovy has more roles than just war, it is listed as an Explorer, but it's built for war as well as exploration, think of it this way, they needed a strong militaristic force but, you dont want to mothball them in times of peace to build ships for exploring..

Tactical Explorer lol
I don't know if it is an Explorer. Heavy Cruiser might make more sense, especially if your claims about its lacking accommodations and "diplomatic potential" and focus on combat systems were true. I don't think they are true, but would nevertheless be willing to accept Heavy Cruiser as a compromise toward the idea that the Sovereign class is designed for a slightly less wide range of mission profiles than the Galaxy class.

(Fans grabbed on to the fact that Enterprise-E apparently doesn't carry families as meaning that it was built for war, but I suspect the Galaxy ships carry families and civilian consultants and such because they are designed for independent missions of very long duration (15-20 years, perhaps?). A Sovereign-class ship may be intended for missions of exploration and scientific inquiry that are more limited in scope.)

Last edited by JNG; February 22 2009 at 08:29 AM.
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