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-   -   What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members? (http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=245536)

Wadjda May 24 2014 06:16 PM

What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
I assume if a planet becomes a Federation member there are some minimal human rights requirements.

What should those be?

Timo May 24 2014 07:41 PM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
Since humans supposedly meet these criteria, too, probably the standards aren't set very high.

Timo Saloniemi

Annorax849 May 24 2014 10:39 PM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
I would think it's a united government, democratic with safeguards against a tyranny of the majority, and no government segregation. I don't think I've ever seen the entire episode, but I think the Cloud Minders were allowed in because it was economic segregation, might be wrong though.

C.E. Evans May 24 2014 10:43 PM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
No eating of fellow citizens.

Melakon May 24 2014 11:24 PM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
Warp capability would seem to be a requirement in most cases. Not sure if there are any Federation members who have never left their own star system.

T'Girl May 25 2014 01:32 AM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
Quote:

Melakon wrote: (Post 9620632)
Warp capability would seem to be a requirement in most cases. Not sure if there are any Federation members who have never left their own star system.

Having indigiously invented warp drive might not be a requirement, provided they acquired it somehow. I've thought for sometime that if a civilization were sufficiently advance in all other ways, but lacked a warp drive, that they still might be considered for membership.

Membership might be a matter of what you could bring to the Federation whole, what you can put on the table. A number of colonies perhaps, a local fleet so that you can "nail down" your section of the Federation, an unusual resource (Ardana), good relations with a species that the current Federation has had problems with and wants to be closer too.

You have to buy your way into the game.

Quote:

Annorax849 wrote: (Post 9620473)
I would think it's a united government, democratic with safeguards against a tyranny of the majority, and no government segregation. I don't think I've ever seen the entire episode, but I think the Cloud Minders were allowed in because it was economic segregation, might be wrong though.

"and no government segregation," I not completely sure I know what you mean by this.

Picard mention something once about a world government, or something to that effect. I wonder if it would have to be a single planet-wide state, or if the multiple nations of a planet creating a limited governing body to speak with one voice on interstellar matters would satisfy the requirement.

For a planet to be a "democracy?" A ruling monarchy might be interesting, King and Queens.

During ENT Vulcan had the central command running the planet, and while it's clear that there was a change at the top, it isn't clear that the central command structure was dismantled. Older fanzines and fan fiction postulated that Vulcan was governed by a collection of "family clans."

Ardana appeared to be a aristocracy.

There were planets in the Trek-verse that were own by corporations, so some Federation Members might be ruled not so much by governments, but by corporate entities.

:)

Melakon May 25 2014 03:37 AM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
Quote:

T'Girl wrote: (Post 9620995)
Picard mention something once about a world government, or something to that effect. I wonder if it would have to be a single planet-wide state, or if the multiple nations of a planet creating a limited governing body to speak with one voice on interstellar matters would satisfy the requirement.

In "Attached", where Picard and Beverly were forcibly telepathically linked, the fact that two governments were at war on the planet (among other things) was enough to deny their request for admission.

Shat Happens May 26 2014 05:33 AM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
Hot, fit females (for humanoids at least). See examples: Human, Vulcan, Orion (including Abramstrek), Andorian (see ENT) and several other TOS and TNG episodes.

Nerys Myk May 26 2014 05:52 AM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
A valid driver's license and a drug test.

Robert Comsol May 26 2014 11:51 AM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
Quote:

Melakon wrote: (Post 9620632)
Warp capability would seem to be a requirement in most cases. Not sure if there are any Federation members who have never left their own star system.

Warp capability was a retcon concept and frankly I'm wondering if that was a TOS requirement when I actually look at Gideon or Ardana.

There was no indication that the Gideonites had ever made any attempt to leave their planet (or they'd probably long ago started to solve their overpopulation problem by colonizing other planets).

And Droxine had never met a Vulcan nor did she have any knowledge about Vulcans and their biology ("The Clod Minders"). Of course, she may have been "protected" from contact with outsiders, but then again the people of Ardana didn't necessarily have spacecraft either.

KIRK: (dictating) At Federation orders, we're proceeding at top warp speed to the planet Ardana, where the only source of zenite exists. It is the one substance that can halt the plague.

Wouldn't it have sped up the acquisition process hat the people of Ardana sent a transport ship with the zenite to rendezvous with the Enterprise?

OTOH I could imagine both planets having invented satellite technology or the like enabling them to detect warp drive travel of others, which IMHO would equally justify a first contact encounter.

Bob

T'Girl May 26 2014 01:06 PM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
Quote:

Robert Comsol wrote: (Post 9625066)
I'm wondering if that was a TOS requirement when I actually look at Gideon or ...

It's not my impression that Gideon was a Federation Member.

:)

Robert Comsol May 26 2014 02:57 PM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
No, but obviously the UFP wanted Gideon to become one.

Captain's log, stardate 5423.4. We are orbiting the planet Gideon, which is still not a member of the United Federation of Planets. The treaty negotiations have been difficult because Gideon has consistently refused the presence of a delegation from the Federation on its soil, or any surveillance by the ship's sensors. They have finally agreed to a delegation of one. They insisted it be the Captain of the Enterprise. I am, therefore, beaming down at once.

Almost sounds like Gideon was already known in the 21st Century, otherwise that "still not a member" remark is somewhat odd.

Or it's an expression of UFP hegemony that doesn't like the concept of independent planets within "Federation borders"?

Possibly a paradise for tax evasion... ;)

And then we have that mystery planet Gary Seven referred to:

SEVEN: I've been living on another planet far more advanced. I was beaming to Earth when you intercepted me.
KIRK: The location of that planet?
SEVEN: They wish their existence kept secret. Even in your time, it will remain unknown.
SCOTT: It's impossible to hide a whole planet.
SEVEN: Impossible for you, not for them.


Bob

T'Girl May 26 2014 06:52 PM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
Quote:

Robert Comsol wrote: (Post 9625432)
which is still not a member of the United Federation of Planets

An enigmatic statement by Kirk, have to think on it.

:)

King Daniel Into Darkness May 26 2014 11:22 PM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
Lots of that sweet, sweet dilithium.

Annorax849 May 26 2014 11:42 PM

Re: What should be the minimal requirements for Federation members?
 
Quote:

T'Girl wrote: (Post 9620995)
Quote:

Melakon wrote: (Post 9620632)
Warp capability would seem to be a requirement in most cases. Not sure if there are any Federation members who have never left their own star system.

Having indigiously invented warp drive might not be a requirement, provided they acquired it somehow. I've thought for sometime that if a civilization were sufficiently advance in all other ways, but lacked a warp drive, that they still might be considered for membership.

Membership might be a matter of what you could bring to the Federation whole, what you can put on the table. A number of colonies perhaps, a local fleet so that you can "nail down" your section of the Federation, an unusual resource (Ardana), good relations with a species that the current Federation has had problems with and wants to be closer too.

You have to buy your way into the game.

Quote:

Annorax849 wrote: (Post 9620473)
I would think it's a united government, democratic with safeguards against a tyranny of the majority, and no government segregation. I don't think I've ever seen the entire episode, but I think the Cloud Minders were allowed in because it was economic segregation, might be wrong though.

"and no government segregation," I not completely sure I know what you mean by this.

Basically I'm saying that maybe it wasn't a government decree that the society was separated in The Cloud Minders, but just an economic reality. Again, I'm not sure.


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