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-   -   Renumber The Doctors? (http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=231607)

intrinsical November 24 2013 07:47 AM

Renumber The Doctors?
 
I've been discussing this in some other forums and everybody seems split about the issue of John Hurt's character. Has he redeemed himself enough to be called The Doctor again? And if so, does that now make him the 9th Doctor, Eccelston the 10th, Tennant the 11th, Smith the 12th and Capaldi the 13th Doctor?

Or do we retain the current numbering of Doctors with Tennant as 10 and Smith as 11?

Kestrel November 24 2013 07:55 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
Hurt's Doctor absolutely redeemed himself, but I don't like the idea of renumbering. Why not just let him have a name to indicate his uniqueness, the War Doctor. The Medic? :p

Pavonis November 24 2013 07:58 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
The War Doctor. He did indeed reject the title, and spent most of his life as someone who he didn't consider worthy of the name. I wonder what he called himself?

No need to renumber. Eccleston played the tenth incarnation of the Time Lord we refer to as the Doctor, the ninth one to claim the title and keep the promise.

Emh November 24 2013 08:10 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
Not only did he redeem himself, he was forgiven by his future incarnations and they called him "Doctor."

That's enough for me to renumber The Doctors. However, I know this will be hotly debated for years to come and there will always be confusion when talking about The Ninth, Tenth, Eleventh, Twelfth, and upcoming Thirteenth Doctors (and all of the future incarnations).

The Mirrorball Man November 24 2013 08:24 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
Quote:

Emh wrote: (Post 8932054)
Not only did he redeem himself, he was forgiven by his future incarnations and they called him "Doctor."

That's enough for me to renumber The Doctors. However, I know this will be hotly debated for years to come and there will always be confusion when talking about The Ninth, Tenth, Eleventh, Twelfth, and upcoming Thirteenth Doctors (and all of the future incarnations).

I don't think there will be. Moffat has already stated that it doesn't change anything and that Smith still is the eleventh Doctor, so the point is moot and it's only really confusing for people who want it to be confusing.

davejames November 24 2013 09:08 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
Quote:

The Mirrorball Man wrote: (Post 8932105)
I don't think there will be. Moffat has already stated that it doesn't change anything and that Smith still is the eleventh Doctor, so the point is moot and it's only really confusing for people who want it to be confusing.

Agreed. I just don't see an issue here.

The fact Hurt's Doctor was acknowledged as a Doctor two minutes before his regeneration doesn't change the fact he still spent a lifetime being a warrior and acting in a very un-Doctorly kind of way (even if he is no longer responsible for the worst act of wiping out billions of people anymore).

People can quibble over the number of incarnations if they want, but as far as "true Doctors" go, it seems obvious that he shouldn't really qualify. Because he never truly acted like a Doctor.

The Stig November 24 2013 09:10 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
Quote:

davejames wrote: (Post 8932228)
Quote:

The Mirrorball Man wrote: (Post 8932105)
I don't think there will be. Moffat has already stated that it doesn't change anything and that Smith still is the eleventh Doctor, so the point is moot and it's only really confusing for people who want it to be confusing.

Agreed. I just don't see an issue here.

The fact Hurt's Doctor was acknowledged as a Doctor two minutes before his regeneration doesn't change the fact he still spent a lifetime being a warrior and acting in a very un-Doctorly kind of way (even if he is no longer responsible for the worst act of wiping out billions of people anymore).

People can quibble over the number of incarnations if they want, but as far as "true Doctors" go, it seems obvious that he shouldn't really qualify. Because he never truly acted hlike a Doctor.

Horseshit. He acted exactly like The Doctor and performed an act of healing. Hurt is the Ninth, now and forever more.

Emh November 24 2013 09:17 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
Quote:

davejames wrote: (Post 8932228)
People can quibble over the number of incarnations if they want, but as far as "true Doctors" go, it seems obvious that he shouldn't really qualify. Because he never truly acted like a Doctor.

But isn't that just semantics? At the end of the day, Hurt is the ninth incarnation of the physical being known as The Doctor.

Retu November 24 2013 09:23 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
The War Doctor is the 8.5th Doctor.

The Mirrorball Man November 24 2013 09:23 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
Quote:

Emh wrote: (Post 8932267)
Quote:

davejames wrote: (Post 8932228)
People can quibble over the number of incarnations if they want, but as far as "true Doctors" go, it seems obvious that he shouldn't really qualify. Because he never truly acted like a Doctor.

But isn't that just semantics? At the end of the day, Hurt is the ninth incarnation of the physical being known as The Doctor.

He is, but we're specifically talking about renumbering, and no, the War Doctor is not the ninth Doctor.

Candlelight November 24 2013 09:37 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
I always look at the Time Lord from a biological perspective. Basically regenerations limit who the Doctor is in my mind.

1 - Hartnell
2 - Troughton
3 - Pertwee
4 - Baker
5 - Davison
6 - Baker
7 - McCoy
8 - McGann
9 - Hurt
10 - Eccleston
11 - Tennant
12 - Smith
13 - Capaldi

Granted we never see who Hurt regenerates into - we assume Eccleston - but from a biological perspective he can only do it 12 times, we know Capaldi is right round the corner so it has to be him.

And yes, it's gonna balls up every conversation about the Doctors from now on.

StarMan November 24 2013 09:38 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
Begun, the renumbering war has.

The Mirrorball Man November 24 2013 09:45 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
Nah really it's not much of an issue. There's an official version, if people are keen to communicate with other people that's the one they're going to use, no matter what they may think about the merits of the War Doctor. If some people are willing to be obtuse about the whole thing, well, let's all be obtuse: from now on, I'm going to assume that whenever someone is talking about the eleventh Doctor, he's talking about the eleventh Doctor. :D

Candlelight November 24 2013 09:48 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
The issue will be is... who is Capaldi? Do we say 12 (cos there isn't one in the new sequence) or 13 (which he biologically is)?

Guy Gardener November 24 2013 09:49 AM

Re: Renumber The Doctors?
 
For a moment there, I thought that the Hurt Doctor was going to chose not to use the moment, erase everything that has happened since 2005, and then himself after a supreme sacrifice regenerate into Capaldi who is the new 10... Which didn't happen.


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