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-   -   Pre-TOS five year missions in the books (http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=227599)

Noddy October 3 2013 08:28 PM

Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
Okay, STID has it that as of 2260 in the new reality, there has never been a five year mission in the history of Starfleet. Just wondered, are there any books or whatever that posit missions of such lengths prior to the era shown in TOS?

Christopher October 3 2013 08:43 PM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
I've seen fan sources assuming that Spock's 11 years, 4 months, and 5 days under Pike's command encompassed two 5YMs and a bit more, but nothing in the tie-ins seems to support that.

Although let's define our terms a bit more carefully. The phrase "five-year mission" by itself is pretty meaningless. Duration doesn't define a mission; purpose does. What's new as of STID is a dedicated deep-space exploration mission with a planned duration of five years. Which strikes me as a reflection of the particular state of affairs in the alternate reality, where Starfleet seems to have adopted more of a defense-oriented footing in the wake of the Kelvin's destruction. Perhaps it's only now that the pendulum has shifted back toward Starfleet's exploratory responsibilities. If so, that doesn't reveal anything about the state of affairs in the Prime reality.

JD October 3 2013 09:48 PM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
Yeah, I have a feeling by the time we get to STID there is probably very little that is the same between the two universes.

Hartzilla2007 October 3 2013 10:21 PM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
Quote:

Christopher wrote: (Post 8723872)
Which strikes me as a reflection of the particular state of affairs in the alternate reality, where Starfleet seems to have adopted more of a defense-oriented footing in the wake of the Kelvin's destruction. Perhaps it's only now that the pendulum has shifted back toward Starfleet's exploratory responsibilities. If so, that doesn't reveal anything about the state of affairs in the Prime reality.

I don't know Kirk in TMP seemed to think the 5 year mission was a big deal seeing as that was part of his justification for taking back command of the Enterprise, so it kind of implies not everyone was doing those.

Besides the Enterprise was still probably doing the usual TOS things judging by the star of Into Darkness, they just went back to Earth after finishing up instead of going to the next random planet.

Honestly I'm starting to wonder if a 5 year mission just means running from planet to planet with occasional stops at starbases for 5 years where as regular missions are going to the planet conducting the mission and then returning to the ship's home port (which is kind of the impression I got of what the Enterprise was doing in the TOS films).

Avro Arrow October 4 2013 04:26 AM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
Quote:

Hartzilla2007 wrote: (Post 8724400)
I don't know Kirk in TMP seemed to think the 5 year mission was a big deal seeing as that was part of his justification for taking back command of the Enterprise, so it kind of implies not everyone was doing those.

I think I just took that as Kirk emphasizing that he'd faced the unknown "out there" as a captain for five years already, whereas Decker was a newly minted captain. I'm not sure one can really extrapolate that to determine whether a certain mission duration was common or uncommon.

tomswift2002 October 4 2013 04:40 AM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
Quote:

Noddy wrote: (Post 8723752)
Okay, STID has it that as of 2260 in the new reality, there has never been a five year mission in the history of Starfleet. Just wondered, are there any books or whatever that posit missions of such lengths prior to the era shown in TOS?


There's been nothing in the 2009/2013 films to say that "Enterprise" did not occur as it did, so you'd have a two-year mission (as I recall, Enterprise, after "Broken Bow" never returned to Earth till "The Xindi"). From what I could tell, the NX-01 model in the 2013 film looked just like the NX-01 from the TV series.

But I believe "Starfleet Year One" had the newly launched Dadelus heading out on a multi-year mission.

Therin of Andor October 4 2013 06:34 AM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
Quote:

Hartzilla2007 wrote: (Post 8724400)
I don't know Kirk in TMP seemed to think the 5 year mission was a big deal seeing as that was part of his justification for taking back command of the Enterprise, so it kind of implies not everyone was doing those.

IIRC, the TMP novelization says something about the Enterprise being the first of its class to return from a 5YM with the ship and its crew "relatively unscathed".

The trilogy "My Brother's Keeper" has pre-TOS stuff with Kirk and Gary Mitchell. Not sure if it specifies the lengths of other vessel's missions.

King Daniel Into Darkness October 4 2013 10:10 AM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
Quote:

Therin of Andor wrote: (Post 8726173)
IIRC, the TMP novelization says something about the Enterprise being the first of its class to return from a 5YM with the ship and its crew "relatively unscathed"

Mr. Scott's Guide to the Enterprise goes one further, and says Kirk's Enterprise was the only one of the original 13 Constitution-class ships to return at all. Shane Johnson uses this to justify the Enterprise's extensive refit (she and her crew are famous now) and the Enterprise emblem being adopted fleet-wide.
Quote:

JD wrote: (Post 8724271)
Yeah, I have a feeling by the time we get to STID there is probably very little that is the same between the two universes.

Unless you read the comics, in which case a bunch of TOS' 5-year mission missions happened years earlier and before this new Enterprise's 5YM.:wtf:

NightJim October 4 2013 12:12 PM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
Have we never had any sort of clarification on April or Pike, other than the assumption based on Spock's service level with the latter? I guess even stating how long TOS Enterprise was in service doesn't help because that doesn't specify the missions it was doing.

Timewalker October 4 2013 10:31 PM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
I got the impression that 5 years was the duration of Kirk's captaincy, after which Starfleet would decide if he would continue as captain or assign him elsewhere.

Jon P October 4 2013 11:09 PM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
It might be worth looking at Best Destiny, which has Kirk as a teenager on the Enterprise with his dad and Robert April. I don't remember much about it, but it may address the 5-year mission question.

Therin of Andor October 4 2013 11:45 PM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
Quote:

NightJim wrote: (Post 8726800)
Have we never had any sort of clarification on April or Pike, other than the assumption based on Spock's service level with the latter?

Someone went wild with this "stub" on Memory Beta, but I can't see it's based on many actual references.

http://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/Five-year_mission

Leto_II October 5 2013 05:40 AM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
Quote:

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: (Post 8726593)
Quote:

Therin of Andor wrote: (Post 8726173)
IIRC, the TMP novelization says something about the Enterprise being the first of its class to return from a 5YM with the ship and its crew "relatively unscathed"

Mr. Scott's Guide to the Enterprise goes one further, and says Kirk's Enterprise was the only one of the original 13 Constitution-class ships to return at all. Shane Johnson uses this to justify the Enterprise's extensive refit (she and her crew are famous now) and the Enterprise emblem being adopted fleet-wide.

Judith and Garfield Reeves-Stevens later went against this in The Ashes of Eden, where it's mentioned that Androvar Drake managed to bring his Constitution-class starship back from its 5-year mission only a month after Kirk returned from his; Kirk being the first starship captain in history to do so.

Of course, other sources would later contradict this account, with Captain Pike having commanded several successful 5-year missions before Kirk, but that's pretty much par for the ST-continuity course.

Christopher October 5 2013 02:00 PM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
Quote:

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: (Post 8726593)
Shane Johnson uses this to justify the Enterprise's extensive refit (she and her crew are famous now) and the Enterprise emblem being adopted fleet-wide.

Which is ignoring the evidence from "Court-Martial" that other starships already used the arrowhead insignia. A lot of stuff in that book was not very credible, and it's no surprise that it hasn't been drawn on much as a reference. (I've referenced it a bit in my post-TMP novels, but only selectively.)

CorporalCaptain October 5 2013 03:35 PM

Re: Pre-TOS five year missions in the books
 
Quote:

Christopher wrote: (Post 8723872)
I've seen fan sources assuming that Spock's 11 years, 4 months, and 5 days under Pike's command encompassed two 5YMs and a bit more, but nothing in the tie-ins seems to support that.

Although let's define our terms a bit more carefully. The phrase "five-year mission" by itself is pretty meaningless. Duration doesn't define a mission; purpose does. What's new as of STID is a dedicated deep-space exploration mission with a planned duration of five years. Which strikes me as a reflection of the particular state of affairs in the alternate reality, where Starfleet seems to have adopted more of a defense-oriented footing in the wake of the Kelvin's destruction. Perhaps it's only now that the pendulum has shifted back toward Starfleet's exploratory responsibilities. If so, that doesn't reveal anything about the state of affairs in the Prime reality.

Well, whether that's really new as of STID depends largely upon whether one considers William Shatner's voiceover in TOS to function as words from the mouth of an omniscient narrator, speaking of the way things are in-universe. If you do (and I do), then it's reasonably explicit that the TOS Enterprise had been sent by Starfleet on a mission that had a planned duration of five years and that had the intended purpose to explore strange new worlds, seek out new life forms, etc. Perhaps you are arguing that the TOS Enterprise's flight path wasn't always dedicated to traveling in deep space, since she often returned to base, or that the mission was not one exclusively of exploration (both of which I'd concede)?


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