The Trek BBS

The Trek BBS (http://www.trekbbs.com/index.php)
-   Star Trek Movies XI+ (http://www.trekbbs.com/forumdisplay.php?f=50)
-   -   Second try finishing STID...better this time around. (http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=226945)

oddsigve September 26 2013 12:29 AM

Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
First time I viewed STID I was filled with hope that the movie wasen`t a mindless action movie, but it is in my opinion. The first time I watched it I could not even finish it, but this time around I enjoyed it. I guess the reason for that is simple enough. I knew what to expect and adjusted my expectations accordingly and the fact that I`ve just finished a marathon with TNG,DS9,VOY helped. Lack of material kinda drew me towards the movie again.

Maybe my experience could help others :rommie:

Awesome Possum September 26 2013 02:27 AM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
It is a mindless action movie if you ignore all the commentary. Just like how the original series is a mindless space adventure show if you ignore all the commentary.

JarodRussell September 26 2013 12:01 PM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
What commentary? Cruise missiles and evil admirals are bad?

And mindless it was indeed. The action and eye candy in the prologue rely on extreme contrivances. What is the reason to hide the ship under water? Why can't they suddenly not beam someone? The chase sequence with the Klingons comes out of nowhere and is absolutely unnesseccarry. You could cut it out and it wouldn't change a thing. And that's only a few examples.

King Daniel Into Darkness September 26 2013 02:42 PM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
^Show me an episode or movie that can't be picked apart in a similar fashion by an OCD spaz.

ComicGuy89 September 26 2013 03:40 PM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
Quote:

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: (Post 8693605)
^Show me an episode or movie that can't be picked apart in a similar fashion by an OCD spaz.

And it's not just Star Trek too, it's the majority of movies and TV shows out there, whatever genre you can think of.

BillJ September 26 2013 03:59 PM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
Quote:

oddsigve wrote: (Post 8691727)
First time I viewed STID I was filled with hope that the movie wasen`t a mindless action movie, but it is in my opinion. The first time I watched it I could not even finish it, but this time around I enjoyed it. I guess the reason for that is simple enough. I knew what to expect and adjusted my expectations accordingly and the fact that I`ve just finished a marathon with TNG,DS9,VOY helped. Lack of material kinda drew me towards the movie again.

Maybe my experience could help others :rommie:

Its no more an mindless action movie than Star Trek: First Contact.

JamesRye September 26 2013 04:23 PM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
It's not mindless.

The movie acts as a metaphor for America’s descent into moral ambiguity following the terrorist attacks of 9/11. The hunt for John Harrison is analagous to the search for Bin Laden and the debate about whether to launch photon torpedoes at the Klingon home world is relevant to current debates regarding the morality of drone strikes.

It's also quite fun.
For more information on why the film is actually surprisingly political:

http://ryesofthegeek.wordpress.com/2...s-film-review/


And yeh, which of the TNG films was a cutting social commentary with interesting things to say?

Cinema Geekly September 26 2013 06:41 PM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
Quote:

JamesRye wrote: (Post 8693851)
And yeh, which of the TNG films was a cutting social commentary with interesting things to say?

I would argue that all of them have commentary. They just aren't new commentaries, we've seen them in Trek before.

I like that they took the effort to ask political questions in an ambiguous way in STID, but this is 2013, the internet has been around for a while now.

It's not like they were talking about things in that movie that people haven't already been talking about for years now.

In that way it is difficult to make a movie with a message, unless that message is about something that virtually nobody talks about.

Awesome Possum September 27 2013 03:56 AM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
Quote:

King Daniel Into Darkness wrote: (Post 8693605)
^Show me an episode or movie that can't be picked apart in a similar fashion by an OCD spaz.

Balance of Terror is stupid, it's just about how stupid hate and war is. Anyone can say that.

STiD attacked the United States foreign policy in a summer action movie, at a time where we are in two wars and the government seems eager for a third. All while using drones to invade the air spaces of other countries to kill people without a trial.

That's sort of a big deal and a major one considering that a major film studio did it with one of the best known media franchises in history as one of their tentpole films.

Regardless if you enjoyed the story, it is a message and a bold one to take. If you can't see that your irrational hate of the movie has blinded you to the obvious.

Opus September 27 2013 05:23 AM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
Quote:

oddsigve wrote: (Post 8691727)
First time I viewed STID I was filled with hope that the movie wasen`t a mindless action movie, but it is in my opinion. The first time I watched it I could not even finish it, but this time around I enjoyed it. I guess the reason for that is simple enough. I knew what to expect and adjusted my expectations accordingly and the fact that I`ve just finished a marathon with TNG,DS9,VOY helped. Lack of material kinda drew me towards the movie again.

Maybe my experience could help others :rommie:

One
Hopes it could help. But

Just a little maybe.
Anybody who felt they same way for sure.
Realize not every single
One feels the same way.
Don't you agree?

Since you bring it up:
Out of all the Treks.
Can you identify the one you
Know is your favorite?

Awesome Possum September 27 2013 08:04 AM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
What was the message for Insurrection? Don't move native people for reasons that could benefit other people? Even though there's that episode where they move the Native American stereotypes off that colony for reasons I can't remember, but Picard was just going to beam them up like the space hippies. So that's weird. The rest about revenge being a bad thing and Picard's line about time and death that spells it out in Generations.

ComicGuy89 September 27 2013 10:16 AM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
Quote:

Awesome Possum wrote: (Post 8696860)
What was the message for Insurrection? Don't move native people for reasons that could benefit other people? Even though there's that episode where they move the Native American stereotypes off that colony for reasons I can't remember, but Picard was just going to beam them up like the space hippies. So that's weird. The rest about revenge being a bad thing and Picard's line about time and death that spells it out in Generations.

In my opinion, Insurrection failed in delivering its message. It clearly wanted a moral about how forced relocation is bad, but they made the Ba'ku appear extremely selfish, unwilling to share their planet just to preserve their luxuries. It was made worse when Picard developed a romantic relationship with one of them, introducing the possibility of bias on his part.

CommishSleer September 27 2013 11:38 AM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
Quote:

oddsigve wrote: (Post 8691727)
First time I viewed STID I was filled with hope that the movie wasen`t a mindless action movie, but it is in my opinion. The first time I watched it I could not even finish it, but this time around I enjoyed it. I guess the reason for that is simple enough. I knew what to expect and adjusted my expectations accordingly and the fact that I`ve just finished a marathon with TNG,DS9,VOY helped. Lack of material kinda drew me towards the movie again.

Maybe my experience could help others :rommie:

Man up.

My 4 year old girl managed to watch it in 3D in the cinema. She managed to stay until the end.

I watched "The Naked Now" the whole way through without crying. Sure there was screaming, hand wringing and eye rolling but I manned up and saw the whole thing.

Like another poster I can't believe people saw deep and meangingful messages in INS but are traumatised by the 'shallowness' of STID.:lol:

teacake September 27 2013 11:43 AM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
INS is just a bloated double episode full of classic Trek tropes. Not good, not bad, not really a movie.

Franklin September 27 2013 02:23 PM

Re: Second try finishing STID...better this time around.
 
Does the one hundredth person to open another hate thread like this win anything?

I will say that if one isn't familiar with the politics of the U.S., especially since 9/11, some of the allusions in the movie may be lost on that person. But mindless action? Really? There wasn't even one thing meaningful in that movie for an engaged mind to comprehend? Really? No theme? No character arcs? Nothing? Nothing at all?

(By the way folks, it's fine to have the opinion that the movie is full of too many contrivances and not well written, but how does that lead to the conclusion that it's also devoid of ideas, themes, and character arcs?)


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:40 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.