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Bry_Sinclair August 29 2013 10:28 AM

Warp 10
 
In "Threshold" achieving warp ten caused Janeway and Paris to 'evolve' into salamander-type humans, but once back on Voyager the EMH was able to cure them of their odd affliction.

So why didn't they make the modifications to the warp core and get back to Earth at the end of the episode? The condition obviously wasn't life-threatening and could easily be reversed--which the EMH could do the moment they dropped out of warp in the Sol System seeing as he wouldn't be affected by the process.

So why not go ahead and do it then put up with the bizarre side effects for a few days?

teacake August 29 2013 10:32 AM

Re: Warp 10
 
BECAUSE.. when they came out of warp 10 and were back on earth and the EMH had restored them all the whole ship would be crawling with embarrassing salamander babies that they couldn't just ditch because this wasn't the DQ any more.

Guy Gardener August 29 2013 10:34 AM

Re: Warp 10
 
Or why not have a holographic pilot?

This was the beginning of the technology.

They still had no idea how to navigate in transwarp space.

They didn't even know how to exit transwarp space safely.

They just turned the engine off and hoped they weren't going to exit into a sun.

teacake August 29 2013 10:37 AM

Re: Warp 10
 
Would a holographic pilot be able to tell what effects warp 10 would have on humans?

Did they even suspect there would be effects? No, I don't think so. So yeah why not have a holographic pilot?

The answer being, Tom needed to sow some piloting oats and be a hero. And Janeway wanted to do what she could for crew morale and let him.

Lighthammer August 29 2013 10:41 AM

Re: Warp 10
 
What always drove me nuts about this episode is it was previously established going faster then Warp 10 was viable in overload conditions (See Star Trek 1) and reinforced else where.

The theory-held that Transwarp was simply pushing off another form of substance gradients that essentially allowed for more efficient and thus potentially faster warp speeds.

The theory, as I understood it, up until "Threshold" (S02E15) was going beyond Warp 100 is what gave you crazy effects as seen in "Where No One Has Gone Before" (TNG S1E06).

Voyager's whole Warp 10 ordeal kind of just shattered a whole bunch of heavily implied in show references and a whole bunch of written reference material over the course of the few seconds they broke warp 10 and things kind of "exploded".

I have to admit, I have a big grudge against Brannon Braga (writer of this episode) for basically throwing a whole bunch of martial out the window, not even referencing any scientific material on the topic an coming up with something that REALLY makes no sense.

teacake August 29 2013 10:45 AM

Re: Warp 10
 
Quote:

Lighthammer wrote: (Post 8571058)
scientific material on the topic

There's your problem.

But doesn't the work around explanation say that the definition of warp changed over the years?

Lighthammer August 29 2013 10:54 AM

Re: Warp 10
 
Quote:

teacake wrote: (Post 8571064)
Quote:

Lighthammer wrote: (Post 8571058)
scientific material on the topic

There's your problem.

But doesn't the work around explanation say that the definition of warp changed over the years?

Between TOS and the movies. When the movies hit, they are using the same warp factor as TNG.

As I understand it, they essentially converted when they migrated to the new warp cores.

Example (though not canon):
http://youtu.be/mLyUGwzPFdU?t=5m30s

Melakon August 29 2013 11:02 AM

Re: Warp 10
 
Warp drive, transwarp drive, transwarp conduits, slipstream drive-- the warp scale probably had to be adjusted as each of these became known, whether developed by the Federation or not.

MacLeod August 29 2013 11:40 AM

Re: Warp 10
 
Quote:

Bry_Sinclair wrote: (Post 8570992)
In "Threshold" achieving warp ten caused Janeway and Paris to 'evolve' into salamander-type humans, but once back on Voyager the EMH was able to cure them of their odd affliction.

So why didn't they make the modifications to the warp core and get back to Earth at the end of the episode? The condition obviously wasn't life-threatening and could easily be reversed--which the EMH could do the moment they dropped out of warp in the Sol System seeing as he wouldn't be affected by the process.

So why not go ahead and do it then put up with the bizarre side effects for a few days?

Congratualtions you've just ended the show. That was one of the many problems with this episode they were fully able to get home and any minor side effects of the trip could be reversed.

teacake August 29 2013 11:42 AM

Re: Warp 10
 
Would YOU volunteer to be turned into a lizard and then have a hologram reverse you?

I'd rather stay in the DQ.

Guy Gardener August 29 2013 11:59 AM

Re: Warp 10
 
OKuda invented the warp ten limit and that little graph with the asymptote in your encyclopaedia back when they where spit balling before the first season of TNG.

The warp scale had been recalibrated instory between TOS and TNG at an undisclosed point.

The fucked up thing is that then Berman goes and invents a prequel where he is more than clearly using the TNG warp scale.

Lt. Uhura-Brown August 29 2013 12:00 PM

Re: Warp 10
 
How long did it take Tom to evolve Pokémon-style into a salamander? Was it longer than a few minutes before the first symptoms appeared?

Couldn't the Doctor just make a load of anti-proton inoculations, and give one to every crew member to self-administer immediately after they completed the transwarp jaunt?

teacake August 29 2013 12:02 PM

Re: Warp 10
 
This is all highly experimental.

What if you got back to earth and the inoculation wore off unexpectedly during your big reunion?

Guy Gardener August 29 2013 12:53 PM

Re: Warp 10
 
This salamander thing happened to Tom because he had wonky insides.

Quote:

PARIS: Now, why do I get the feeling this isn't just a social call?
JANEWAY: I've just spoken to the Doctor, and it's his opinion that we let Ensign Kim make the test flight.
PARIS: May I ask why?
JANEWAY: He checked over your biometric readings from the shuttle simulations. He says you have a slight enzymatic imbalance in your cerebellum.
PARIS: So?
JANEWAY: I know it doesn't sound like much, but he can't predict what'll happen when you cross the threshold. He believes there's a small chance that you could suffer a brain haemorrhage under the subspace stress.
PARIS: How big a chance?
JANEWAY: Two percent.
PARIS: Two percent? I'll take that chance.
JANEWAY: There's no reason to. Ensign Kim is capable of piloting the shuttle for this mission.
PARIS: Yeah, he's capable. That's not the point.
Tom didn't give a damn.

Okay here's the pickle.

The chances of Kathryn having EXACTLY THE SAME ENZYMATIC IMBALANCE are fantastically unlikely unless there is a close familial bond between the two.

Brother and sister, or mother and son?

teacake August 29 2013 01:16 PM

Re: Warp 10
 
You just want incest.

Did it say anywhere that this enzymatic imbalance actually caused the evolutionary event?


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