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-   -   Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed (http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=214129)

brian577 May 23 2013 05:09 AM

Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_3320757.html

Keep in the mind this message is not meant for athiests but for Catholics. I have a feeling this won't sit right with some of them. Maybe I can finally tell my parents I'm agnostic now.

Quote:

"The Lord created us in His image and likeness, and we are the image of the Lord, and He does good and all of us have this commandment at heart: do good and do not do evil. All of us. ‘But, Father, this is not Catholic! He cannot do good.’ Yes, he can... "The Lord has redeemed all of us, all of us, with the Blood of Christ: all of us, not just Catholics. Everyone! ‘Father, the atheists?’ Even the atheists. Everyone!".. We must meet one another doing good. ‘But I don’t believe, Father, I am an atheist!’ But do good: we will meet one another there.”

Kelthaz May 23 2013 05:18 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
Well, it's a step in the right direction I guess.

1001001 May 23 2013 05:24 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
This is perfectly consistent with what I was taught in school.

There is something called The Doctrine of Implicit Faith.

The way it was explained to me is that if someone gets the message, it doesn't matter whether or not they accept Jesus as their personal savior. Obviously, they understood the important part, and that counts.

This is a key difference between Catholics and some of the Protestant faiths. They might argue that no matter what you do, no matter how good of a person you are, if you don't accept Jesus as your personal savior, you are doomed to hell. Period.

Catholics do not believe that.

In a way, this goes all the way back to the "Faith vs. Works" debate.

teacake May 23 2013 05:24 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
It reads like Dr. Seuss.

Will he do good in a box? Will he do good with the socks?

Lt. Uhura-Brown May 23 2013 05:37 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
Likewise, Catholics who do good will be redeemed in the gravy of His Noodly Appendage.

Santa Claus May 23 2013 05:54 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
That's nice to hear, and I mean that!

Snow Miser May 23 2013 06:07 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
Does this mean I go to Heaven now? Because I already paid for a condo in Hell.

EmoBorg May 23 2013 06:11 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
It is nice of the pope to say that. At least the Catholic Church are not bible literalist.

Timelord Victorious May 23 2013 06:55 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
Take that, Pascal!!

Not sure if this is an entirely good thing.
Maybe this will help against the hate towards atheist:
"Atheist=Hitler!"

Then again, many Catholics might feel, that it lets atheists of the hook and resent them more as "free loaders"; getting the big reward without the work:
Commandments 1-3, anyone?

The Festivus Awakens May 23 2013 07:05 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
Like Digits said, this isn't a new thing for Catholicism, but it's still nice to have it reaffirmed by the new Pope. Good for him.

Between this and what I got from the Dalai Lama, the afterlife is shaping up nicely. Oh, I've never told that story?

So I jump ship in Hong Kong and make my way over to Tibet, and I get on as a looper at a course over in the Himalayas. A looper, you know, a caddy, a looper, a jock. So, I tell them I'm a pro jock, and who do you think they give me? The Dalai Lama, himself. Twelfth son of the Lama. The flowing robes, the grace, bald... striking. So, I'm on the first tee with him. I give him the driver. He hauls off and whacks one - big hitter, the Lama - long, into a ten-thousand foot crevasse, right at the base of this glacier. Do you know what the Lama says? Gunga galunga... gunga, gunga-galunga. So we finish the 18th and he's gonna stiff me. And I say, "Hey, Lama, hey, how about a little something, you know, for the effort, you know." And he says, "Oh, uh, there won't be any money, but when you die, on your deathbed, you will receive total consciousness." So I got that goin' for me, which is nice.

Gov Kodos May 23 2013 08:22 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
Quote:

Timelord_Victorious wrote: (Post 8139352)
Take that, Pascal!!

Not sure if this is an entirely good thing.
Maybe this will help against the hate towards atheist:
"Atheist=Hitler!"

Then again, many Catholics might feel, that it lets atheists of the hook and resent them more as "free loaders"; getting the big reward without the work:
Commandments 1-3, anyone?

Recalling elementary school with the nuns, no, I don't think so at large. The classes emphasized following the rules in full faith. Following the rules of the Church without believing in full faith is not going to get you into Heaven. However, if you don't believe, but act in ways good according to the Church with charity, mercy and all that stuff your likely good to get in. They taught God judges on the worthiness of the soul according to His rules, not by the beliefs of men. The Church could be wrong in its understanding of God's will and desires, so there is every possibility someone not Catholic, not Christian, or fully convinced in Atheism can enter Heaven.

Cookies and Cake May 23 2013 08:26 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
Good news!

Now we just have to hear from the Atheist Pope.

JoeZhang May 23 2013 08:40 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
Quote:

Gov Kodos wrote: (Post 8139568)
Quote:

Timelord_Victorious wrote: (Post 8139352)
Take that, Pascal!!

Not sure if this is an entirely good thing.
Maybe this will help against the hate towards atheist:
"Atheist=Hitler!"

Then again, many Catholics might feel, that it lets atheists of the hook and resent them more as "free loaders"; getting the big reward without the work:
Commandments 1-3, anyone?

Recalling elementary school with the nuns, no, I don't think so at large. The classes emphasized following the rules in full faith. Following the rules of the Church without believing in full faith is not going to get you into Heaven. However, if you don't believe, but act in ways good according to the Church with charity, mercy and all that stuff your likely good to get in. They taught God judges on the worthiness of the soul according to His rules, not by the beliefs of men. The Church could be wrong in its understanding of God's will and desires, so there is every possibility someone not Catholic, not Christian, or fully convinced in Atheism can enter Heaven.

ah... the Faith vs works argument - I once saw a stage play at the Christian school I worked at where everyone on a plane that crashed went to hell for not being believers (this included a couple who spent their lives helping the poor), the only person who was saved was a murderer who cried out for forgiveness as the plane went down...

:guffaw:

Gov Kodos May 23 2013 08:44 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
When I think of the Catholic Church, I think of this guy. http://i1108.photobucket.com/albums/...en_whiskey.jpg

R. Star May 23 2013 09:25 AM

Re: Pope: Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed
 
That's interesting news. A responsible religious leader who fundamentally respects other people even if they don't share his beliefs. A great thing... pity his odds of getting killed by some fanatic probably just multiplied by a factor of ten.


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