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-   -   The Dambusters 70 years on (http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=213115)

Starkers May 16 2013 10:35 PM

The Dambusters 70 years on
 
Seventy years since the Lancasters of 617 squadron attacked three dams in the Ruhr Valley with Barnes Wallis' bouncing bombs, and whilst on one level I know it's wrong to glory in war and death, and a lot of people died 70 years ago on both sides, it's hard not to be amazed at the audacity of the mission. Luke skimming down the Death Star trench has nothing on those guys...

I'm biased 'cos I'm British, and because I grew up watching war films and reading war comic books (as I suspect most boys of my age did) but still, hearing the Dambusters March played earlier whilst one of the last remaining Lancs taxied to a halt really did make the hairs on the back of my neck stand on end.

I wonder if Peter Jackson ever will remake the film?

MacLeod May 16 2013 11:09 PM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
I had considered starting apost on this very topic, but I stpped myself, for the reasons you mentioned amongest others.

Yes it was a great technical achievment, flying at 60ft with nothing but a couple of spotlights to tell them they were at 60ft, a bouncing bomb.

Though do we really glorify war when we mark these days? Or is it a way of commerating those who fought for our freedoms? Perhaps in this case it is because it's the 70th anniverdsary of the raid it is getting attention, will the 71st anniversary garner as much attention?

Think about it the 68th Anniversarry of VE day passed by just over a week ago, and I don't recall seeing a thread about it. In many respects perhaps the one day in the UK outside of Remembrance Day and/or Remberance Sunday that perhaps gets a bit of attention would be the 15th September Battle of Britain Day.

Marc May 17 2013 02:30 AM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
Quote:

MacLeod wrote: (Post 8099332)
I had considered starting apost on this very topic, but I stpped myself, for the reasons you mentioned amongest others.

Yes it was a great technical achievment, flying at 60ft with nothing but a couple of spotlights to tell them they were at 60ft, a bouncing bomb.

Though do we really glorify war when we mark these days? Or is it a way of commerating those who fought for our freedoms? Perhaps in this case it is because it's the 70th anniverdsary of the raid it is getting attention, will the 71st anniversary garner as much attention?

No we don't glorify war - we remember the sacrifice that was made by those who served.

Also have to remember that aim of the raid was to shorten the war. Unfortunately history has shown it didn't. Had they breached the 3rd dam (The Sorpe?) I think would have been very different.

Quote:

Think about it the 68th Anniversarry of VE day passed by just over a week ago, and I don't recall seeing a thread about it. In many respects perhaps the one day in the UK outside of Remembrance Day and/or Remberance Sunday that perhaps gets a bit of attention would be the 15th September Battle of Britain Day.
People tend to look at the big anniversary rather than the the in-between. People will remember a 60 and 70th and but something like a 68th tends to pass people by unless it's something commemorated annually with something special.

But people tend to remember the special instances of "daring-do" sometimes over the big events such as VE day.

As for the Dambusters, I have a Dambusters t-shirt but wore it yesterday not today. T-shirt was a present from the wife though more from liking the Lancasters (had two great uncles who flew them, one of who's ashes were scattered at Scampton).

Would have loved to see one flying but the one the flew in to CFB Trenton wasn't able to fly on the day because of technical problems but did get to go aboard.

And any stories you heard about the wing spare being difficult to climb over at true.

sojourner May 17 2013 04:30 AM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
Funny thing, there was a Dambusters reference on the season finale of Elementary tonight.

Owain Taggart May 17 2013 07:48 AM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
There was an episode of Ice Pilots where they tried to recreate the effect of the bomb bouncing across the water. It was rather interesting. It's up on Youtube if you search for it.

Starkers May 17 2013 10:07 AM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
Quote:

MacLeod wrote: (Post 8099332)
I had considered starting apost on this very topic, but I stpped myself, for the reasons you mentioned amongest others.

Yes it was a great technical achievment, flying at 60ft with nothing but a couple of spotlights to tell them they were at 60ft, a bouncing bomb.

Though do we really glorify war when we mark these days? Or is it a way of commerating those who fought for our freedoms? Perhaps in this case it is because it's the 70th anniverdsary of the raid it is getting attention, will the 71st anniversary garner as much attention?

Think about it the 68th Anniversarry of VE day passed by just over a week ago, and I don't recall seeing a thread about it. In many respects perhaps the one day in the UK outside of Remembrance Day and/or Remberance Sunday that perhaps gets a bit of attention would be the 15th September Battle of Britain Day.

I think it is just a case of it being a big number. And it isn't just war. They're celebrating 50 years of Dr Who this year, just as they celebrated 50 years of Bond in 2012. Like you say, no one really cares about the 49th or the 51st.

Quote:

Marc wrote: (Post 8100328)
[
Also have to remember that aim of the raid was to shorten the war. Unfortunately history has shown it didn't. Had they breached the 3rd dam (The Sorpe?) I think would have been very different.

Well this still seems to be up for debate. Dan Snow's written a very interesting article here and I think he talks a lot of sense. Yes the Germans rebuilt the dams very quickly, but they had to retask an awful lot of resourses from other areas to do it, notably diverting men and material from the defence of France. And like he says, the propaganda impact can't be underestimated.

If they had breached the third dam though, well who knows...

The Badger May 17 2013 12:25 PM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
I live in a small village in the Midlands. I guess because of it's location it's often used as a waypoint for military aircraft getting from one place to another. Yesterday afternoon I was astonished and delighted when the Lancaster went over head.

Starkers May 17 2013 12:40 PM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
Fantastic!

Pingfah May 17 2013 12:40 PM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
Quote:

Starkers wrote: (Post 8099149)
I wonder if Peter Jackson ever will remake the film?

Somebody is going to, let's face it. It's a great film and a great story that would engage with modern audiences and make a really good basis for a remake.

Starkers May 17 2013 12:44 PM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
Just so long as they rename the dog...

Starkers May 17 2013 01:28 PM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
Pictures of the majority of aircrew that took part.

It's interesting how the film skews your understanding of the men involved. Because of Richard Todd I'd always seen Guy Gibson as a man in his mid thirties, he was just 24 in reality, which practically made him an old man in bomber crew terms.

bbailey861 May 17 2013 02:32 PM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
The Dambusters is one of my favourite WWII films, along with Sink the Bismark. Some time ago I read that Peter Jackson wanted to remake it and I wondered at the time, if he did, would he ever make his money back? Older farts like me, who grew up on WWII films would certainly go but I don't know if it would hold any interest for many people 40 or younger.

MacLeod May 17 2013 03:41 PM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
Quote:

bbailey861 wrote: (Post 8102848)
The Dambusters is one of my favourite WWII films, along with Sink the Bismark. Some time ago I read that Peter Jackson wanted to remake it and I wondered at the time, if he did, would he ever make his money back? Older farts like me, who grew up on WWII films would certainly go but I don't know if it would hold any interest for many people 40 or younger.


We'll I've enjoyed some of the older WWII films

The Dambusters
Sink The Bismark
Battle of Britain
Tora! Tora! Tora!
Patton
Battle of the Bulge
Battle of the River Plate
The Longest Day.

To name a few.

And yes I'm under 40, but only by a few years.

Starkers May 17 2013 03:44 PM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
Seems like Jackson and co are still interested...

http://dambustersblog.com/category/peter-jackson/

Marc May 17 2013 04:20 PM

Re: The Dambusters 70 years on
 
Quote:

MacLeod wrote: (Post 8103151)
Quote:

bbailey861 wrote: (Post 8102848)
The Dambusters is one of my favourite WWII films, along with Sink the Bismark. Some time ago I read that Peter Jackson wanted to remake it and I wondered at the time, if he did, would he ever make his money back? Older farts like me, who grew up on WWII films would certainly go but I don't know if it would hold any interest for many people 40 or younger.


We'll I've enjoyed some of the older WWII films

The Dambusters
Sink The Bismark
Battle of Britain
Tora! Tora! Tora!
Patton
Battle of the Bulge
Battle of the River Plate
The Longest Day.

To name a few.

And yes I'm under 40, but only by a few years.

No The Compass Rose/The Cruel Sea?.

there was a documentary series on the Dambusters raid made a few years back - anyone else see it?

Finally wasn't till much later after reading it that I found out that even with the talking with 617 survivors that Paul Brickhill's book wasn't that accurate because of there was still a lot of secrecy surrounding it.


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