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-   -   Any chance... (http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=207118)

captain-brad March 24 2013 07:36 PM

Any chance...
 
Any chance that Scott Bakula appears as "Admiral Archer" in STID? They went to the trouble of not only mentioning him in the first movie, but Kirk had some throwaway line about knowing his beagle. Also, it looks like the villain's plans in the sequel have his sights set on earth itself, which would definitely draw the attention of the fleet admiral. I haven't heard any official word on it, but it seems as though Kurtzman and Orci went out of their way to set him up and Kirk's familiarity with at least his dog in the first movie, so I could see this happening without us knowing until we see the flick. JJ is into that whole secrecy thing.

Also, on a slightly related note... does anyone have any theories on what happens to T'Pol in the JJ reality? Was she on Vulcan when it was destroyed or was she on earth? Has there ever been a thread about this?

SalvorHardin March 24 2013 07:39 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
Quote:

captain-brad wrote: (Post 7844752)
Any chance that Scott Bakula appears as "Admiral Archer" in STID?

I'd say no chance at all.

captain-brad March 24 2013 07:43 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
Why?

Franklin March 24 2013 07:54 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
Archer would be over 140 years old in 2258, if he's even alive, which is doubtful.

Who knows about T'Pol? She would've been 170, so she could've been alive when Vulcan was destroyed. But that's getting up there, even for a Vulcan. (By comparison, Spock Prime was "only" 157 in ST09.)

T J March 24 2013 07:58 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
I thought 200 years was the lifespan of most or at least long lived Vulcans.

captain-brad March 24 2013 08:04 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
So, do you think when Scotty mentions his "prize beagle" the assumption is that Archer's no longer alive but his beagle is? Maybe if Archer had died a few years earlier or something. Hm.

I think Old T'Pol was about 170 in the Enterprise episode E2, so it's not too much of a stretch to think that she could still be alive in the STID era.

King Daniel Into Darkness March 24 2013 08:42 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
Although it would be cool, I seriously doubt we'll see Scott Bakula in the movie. There may be some more Enterprise references, though. There are a few in the Star Trek Ongoing between-movies comics.

I pictured Archer as a semi-retired old teacher. At 140, he'd be about the same age Admiral McCoy was in "Encounter at Farpoint" - if he hadn't skipped a few decades using time travel. Which he was something of an expert in!

As for T'Pol... I have no idea. She did become something of a born-again Vulcan in season four, so she may have been there in 2258 :(

M'Sharak March 24 2013 08:43 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
Quote:

captain-brad wrote: (Post 7844881)
So, do you think when Scotty mentions his "prize beagle" the assumption is that Archer's no longer alive but his beagle is? Maybe if Archer had died a few years earlier or something. Hm.

It's not even clear from dialogue that the beagle is alive, let alone Archer.

Suddenly, I'm getting an image of a statue in front of the President Archer Memorial Institute of Theoretical Engineering at Starfleet Academy, or maybe in the lobby—Jonathan Archer as a starship captain, with faithful beagle at his side—and Scotty just "borrowed" him temporarily, thinking old Porthos would be back in place before anyone noticed he'd been missing.

The Wormhole March 24 2013 10:38 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
The Admiral Archer line was only meant to be a throw-away gag, not set-up for an appearance in STID.

CorporalClegg March 24 2013 10:44 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
Quote:

M'Sharak wrote: (Post 7844992)
Quote:

captain-brad wrote: (Post 7844881)
So, do you think when Scotty mentions his "prize beagle" the assumption is that Archer's no longer alive but his beagle is? Maybe if Archer had died a few years earlier or something. Hm.

It's not even clear from dialogue that the beagle is alive, let alone Archer.

Suddenly, I'm getting an image of a statue in front of the President Archer Memorial Institute of Theoretical Engineering at Starfleet Academy, or maybe in the lobby—Jonathan Archer as a starship captain, with faithful beagle at his side—and Scotty just "borrowed" him temporarily, thinking old Porthos would be back in place before anyone noticed he'd been missing.

Except wasn't the Scotty's test specific to bio-matter?

Joerib March 24 2013 10:49 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
In the On going the Beagle did finally materialize on the transporter pad if I remember correctly!!

Gojira March 24 2013 11:00 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
Quote:

Joerib wrote: (Post 7845631)
In the On going the Beagle did finally materialize on the transporter pad if I remember correctly!!

I think it did in the novilization but not in any movie.

M'Sharak March 24 2013 11:05 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
Quote:

CorporalClegg wrote: (Post 7845604)
Quote:

M'Sharak wrote: (Post 7844992)
Quote:

captain-brad wrote: (Post 7844881)
So, do you think when Scotty mentions his "prize beagle" the assumption is that Archer's no longer alive but his beagle is? Maybe if Archer had died a few years earlier or something. Hm.

It's not even clear from dialogue that the beagle is alive, let alone Archer.

Suddenly, I'm getting an image of a statue in front of the President Archer Memorial Institute of Theoretical Engineering at Starfleet Academy, or maybe in the lobby—Jonathan Archer as a starship captain, with faithful beagle at his side—and Scotty just "borrowed" him temporarily, thinking old Porthos would be back in place before anyone noticed he'd been missing.

Except wasn't the Scotty's test specific to bio-matter?

Yeah, actually; I was getting a bit carried away with the statue scenario. :D

In fact, the lead-up line goes "I told him that I could not only beam a grapefruit from one planet to the adjacent planet in the same system ... I could do it with a lifeform." Which kinda suggests he was working with a live beagle. Still, as Wormhole points out above, Admiral Archer's name-check was there to serve as an easter-egg, in the same way as did the order for a Cardassian Sunrise in the shipyard bar, the stenciled "NCC-1701D" on Kirk's escape-pod duffel bag, the tribble on Scotty's work table, and so forth; they were winks to the various other Trek incarnations, rather than hints that Jonathan Archer or a Cardassian or the Ent-D or Cyrano Jones were likely at some point to appear.

Even supposing the alt-verse analog of Archer might still be living in the year 2259, what place would an extremely elderly retired Starfleet admiral and former Federation President have in the story this movie has to tell? There'd have to be some narrative reason for him to appear.

The Wormhole March 24 2013 11:08 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
Quote:

Gojira wrote: (Post 7845667)
Quote:

Joerib wrote: (Post 7845631)
In the On going the Beagle did finally materialize on the transporter pad if I remember correctly!!

I think it did in the novilization but not in any movie.

It happens in both the ending of the novelization and the Tribble two parter in the Ongoing comic series.

CorporalClegg March 24 2013 11:12 PM

Re: Any chance...
 
I would still like to know what the beagle's name was. Assuming the canine life expectancy in the 22nd-23rd century is ~20 years, we have to think Jon was on his fifth or sixth, which would mean he ran out of Musketeers.


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