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-   -   What did Lucas do? (http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=192694)

Anduril October 31 2012 05:36 PM

What did Lucas do?
 
To "ruin" the Star Wars franchise? After seeing all the rage lately, it has made me wonder what was so bad about how he handled the prequels. I personally enjoyed all the films and have always felt that any new Star Wars was a good thing.

I look forward to the new films, but something seems wrong to me about cranking them out every few years.

Kelthaz October 31 2012 05:45 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
Seriously? Just go watch the Red Letter Media films.

Hound of UIster October 31 2012 05:47 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
Essentially he choose to direct all three prequels and did a terrible job at it.

Samurai8472 October 31 2012 05:51 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
Quote:

Rothschild wrote: (Post 7182742)
To "ruin" the Star Wars franchise? After seeing all the rage lately, it has made me wonder what was so bad about how he handled the prequels.


http://i.imgur.com/MQM75.jpg



And also neutering the fearsomeness of Darth Vader to a whiny teen

SimpleLogic October 31 2012 05:51 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
He ruined them by being more interested in the effects than the story. Also he'd rather sell tons of terribly made merchandise and spend time re-releasing the same movies over and over. When it really came down to it all George Lucas has is Star Wars and he's milking it for all its worth. Now Disney is clearly going to do the same, because hey, its Disney, but in any future installments of films without just the sole input of the Bearded One maybe they can get some quality back in the films.

That's the thing I like the most, while Disney doesn't always put out gold at least there can be some fresh perspectives for Star Wars.

DarthTom October 31 2012 05:51 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
Quote:

Rothschild wrote: (Post 7182742)
I look forward to the new films, but something seems wrong to me about cranking them out every few years.

Huh? You feel the same way about Star Trek? Eleven feature films, [the 12th on it's way in 2013] and 6 different television shows including a cartoon series - with 4 of the TV shows happening over the course of twenty some odd years [even overlapping at one point] and you don't think that was over kill?

ST IV released in '88

ST V released in '89

ST VI released '91

ST Generations released in '94

ST First Contact released in '96

ST Insurrection released in '98

ST Nemesis released in 2002


If Disney milks wars half as well as Paramount milked Trek they'll get their $4 billion back in merchandizing, film revenue and even possibly TV revenue back 10 fold.

Anduril October 31 2012 06:00 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
Quote:

Samurai8472 wrote: (Post 7182811)
Quote:

Rothschild wrote: (Post 7182742)
To "ruin" the Star Wars franchise? After seeing all the rage lately, it has made me wonder what was so bad about how he handled the prequels.






And also neutering the fearsomeness of Darth Vader to a whiny teen

I enjoyed the progression of Vader from a "whiny teen" to what we saw in the OT. Would it have been better to have Anakin just waiting to turn to Vader? Adds more depth to the character and the OT IMO.

Gaith October 31 2012 06:08 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
Quote:

Kelthaz wrote: (Post 7182778)
Seriously? Just go watch the Red Letter Media films.

+ Chefelf's "Reasons to Hate" series. Too lazy to link, but easily googlable.

DarKush October 31 2012 06:09 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
I don't think Lucas ruined Star Wars, though I wish the prequels had been better (especially The Phantom Menace) and focused more on character than special effects. I have to admit that I did think he 'ruined' Vader for me. Even though I don't loath Hayden Christensen's performance, the Vader from the original films is diminished by Anakin's prequel portrayal.

Also, I didn't like all the Chosen One, virgin birth stuff, or Lucas making Vader the center of the Star Wars saga. The prophecy he came up with seemed to fit Luke better, and I have to wonder if it was all about selling the prequels that compelled Lucas to make it otherwise. Also I haven't cared for his tinkering with the originals. I didn't mind adding some special effects or a scene here or there to make them fit more with the prequels but sometimes I felt he was just changing stuff just to change it, to create more incentive for fans to dig back into their pockets.

Anduril October 31 2012 06:09 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
Quote:

SimpleLogic wrote: (Post 7182814)
He ruined them by being more interested in the effects than the story. Also he'd rather sell tons of terribly made merchandise and spend time re-releasing the same movies over and over. When it really came down to it all George Lucas has is Star Wars and he's milking it for all its worth. Now Disney is clearly going to do the same, because hey, its Disney, but in any future installments of films without just the sole input of the Bearded One maybe they can get some quality back in the films.

That's the thing I like the most, while Disney doesn't always put out gold at least there can be some fresh perspectives for Star Wars.

From my understanding, Lucas felt constrained by the special effects technology of the day, so when he had a chance with modern tech, he went wild. I've always been a special effects junky so the PT was a thrill for me.

I never expected any "haughty" science fiction from these movies. They are what they are. Some people just like their original popcorn flicks from the modern popcorn flicks.

FPAlpha October 31 2012 06:21 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
Quote:

Rothschild wrote: (Post 7182913)
Quote:

SimpleLogic wrote: (Post 7182814)
He ruined them by being more interested in the effects than the story. Also he'd rather sell tons of terribly made merchandise and spend time re-releasing the same movies over and over. When it really came down to it all George Lucas has is Star Wars and he's milking it for all its worth. Now Disney is clearly going to do the same, because hey, its Disney, but in any future installments of films without just the sole input of the Bearded One maybe they can get some quality back in the films.

That's the thing I like the most, while Disney doesn't always put out gold at least there can be some fresh perspectives for Star Wars.

From my understanding, Lucas felt constrained by the special effects technology of the day, so when he had a chance with modern tech, he went wild. I've always been a special effects junky so the PT was a thrill for me.

I never expected any "haughty" science fiction from these movies. They are what they are. Some people just like their original popcorn flicks from the modern popcorn flicks.

I'm not so sure that an unlimited SFX budget is such a good thing.. you can show pretty mucn anything your mind conceives with digital technology these daysbut i believe it makes you lazy.

Lucas was forced to improvise in the 70s because the tech wasn't ready for his visions but did it take away in any shape or form from the movies? Movies should tell a story, have characters act in them but where's the story in a 20 minute speeder race whose sole purpose is to free one of the main characters so he can tag along with the others?

It's about 15 minutes longer than it needs to be.. it's just eyecandy and that's what's wrong with Lucas.. for me.

He turned from a storyteller to a showman.. he replaced story with flashy effects and action scenes and thus did a huge disservice to his movies. The new movies are just a collection of CGI set pieces and action scenes to wow you with the visuals but the characters (and thus also the actors) were very bland bordering on terrible.

Temis the Vorta October 31 2012 06:40 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
Quote:

Hound of UIster wrote: (Post 7182796)
Essentially he choose to direct all three prequels and did a terrible job at it.

Let's not forget how bad the writing was. The best director ever wouldn't have been able to salvage that garbage.

The effects aren't the problem. A solid director with a solid script could stuff the movie full of snazzy SFX and not hurt anything. Directing and writing (and acting, which is partly the responsibility of the director) are the core of moviemaking. If you don't have those, it's like trying to build a house on sand, No foundation, it falls down.

BillJ October 31 2012 06:40 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
Quote:

Rothschild wrote: (Post 7182874)

I enjoyed the progression of Vader from a "whiny teen" to what we saw in the OT. Would it have been better to have Anakin just waiting to turn to Vader? Adds more depth to the character and the OT IMO.

By making Anakin whiny, no one actually cared about his path to becoming Vader. There was no moment where we felt for the characters downfall because we didn't care about the character.

Gaith October 31 2012 06:40 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
@FP Alpha: Quite. As The Phantom Editor has pointed out, at the time the OT was made, Lucas actually criticized earlier, less popular sci-fi productions for dwelling on eye candy instead of telling the leanest, most efficient story. On the AOTC dvd, however, he says the Obi/Jango fight scene is mainly there to show off Fett's cool jetpack. Lucas didn't just gain the tools to put anything he wanted on screen; he lost the filmmaking sharpness to make things "faster, and more intense!"

Silvercrest October 31 2012 06:46 PM

Re: What did Lucas do?
 
Quote:

Rothschild wrote: (Post 7182874)
Quote:

Samurai8472 wrote: (Post 7182811)
Quote:

Rothschild wrote: (Post 7182742)
To "ruin" the Star Wars franchise? After seeing all the rage lately, it has made me wonder what was so bad about how he handled the prequels.

And also neutering the fearsomeness of Darth Vader to a whiny teen

I enjoyed the progression of Vader from a "whiny teen" to what we saw in the OT. Would it have been better to have Anakin just waiting to turn to Vader? Adds more depth to the character and the OT IMO.

No, it would have added more depth if he was actually likeable first. The fall of Vader was supposed to be a tragedy. It isn't one if you don't like him in the first place. It's more like, "Fine, good riddance."

Plus it kind of undercuts his redemption in ROTJ. The natural reaction is, "So what if he came back to the side of good? HE'S STILL A JERK!"

Edit: Curses, BillJ beat me to it!


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