The Trek BBS

The Trek BBS (http://www.trekbbs.com/index.php)
-   TV & Media (http://www.trekbbs.com/forumdisplay.php?f=28)
-   -   Dexter and what he does. (http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=192649)

SimpleLogic October 31 2012 01:24 AM

Dexter and what he does.
 
So are we supposed to like Dexter in sort of a Punisher type way or are we supposed to hate him because he's not a good guy, or is he?

What does D&D call him? Chaotic good, something like that?

The show is OK but I just don't see it ending well for him and I don't know how I should feel about it. Because really he is no better than the people he kills right?

Trekker4747 October 31 2012 01:30 AM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
D&D (pre 4.0) would likely have him as Lawful Evil. As in he, largely, obeys the law except when it conflicts with his views in which case he does "evil" things.

As for how it'll end? Hard to say, but I reckon the character isn't heading to a good ending.

Guy Gardener October 31 2012 02:18 AM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
have the final season set during a Zombie Apocalypse.

Now Dexter is perfectly capable of surviving, but would his dark passenger be satisfied with killing the undead?

SimpleLogic October 31 2012 02:27 AM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
Quote:

Guy Gardener wrote: (Post 7180051)
have the final season set during a Zombie Apocalypse.

Now Dexter is perfectly capable of surviving, but would his dark passenger be satisfied with killing the undead?

He'll only kill the undead criminals.:rofl:

Mister Fandango October 31 2012 03:30 AM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
Quote:

Circus Peanut wrote: (Post 7179739)
D&D (pre 4.0) would likely have him as Lawful Evil. As in he, largely, obeys the law except when it conflicts with his views in which case he does "evil" things.

Lawful Neutral (with strong Good tendencies as he matures during the season). He is in no way evil; that implies a certain type of intent with one's behavior. A tiger isn't evil when it mauls its stalks and kills its prey, whether its an antelope or a zoo keeper who makes a fatal mistake in his care and handling of the animal.

No, Dexter is an inherently good person, and he follows a very strong code of ethics to help him advance the cause of good. Sometimes he lapses, sometimes he makes mistake, but his goal is actually a noble one. It's just one that doesn't abide by the laws of the land (which has nothing to do with he Lawful alignment, which is more about discipline and structure, which Dexter has in spades).

The only reason he isn't actually Lawful Good is because he does enjoy what he does to a certain extent and he does kill innocents when they risk exposing him, ala victims like Doakes. But even enjoying the kill isn't enough to make him evil anymore than it is for a Paladin who enjoys slaughtering of zombie hordes in the name of his god.

But in the end, how is he really different from the legal system? It finds its evil-doers, it judges them based on their own codes of conduct, and then if deemed unreedemable, they are executed and disposed of. That's exactly what Dexter does; he just has his own code rather than the American legal system.

davejames October 31 2012 06:14 PM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
Quote:

SimpleLogic wrote: (Post 7179703)
So are we supposed to like Dexter in sort of a Punisher type way or are we supposed to hate him because he's not a good guy, or is he?

I don't think we're supposed to like OR hate him. We're just supposed to find him fascinating and compelling to watch, in the same way we find Walter White or Tony Soprano fascinating and compelling to watch.

Mr. Laser Beam October 31 2012 09:31 PM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
Quote:

Mister Fandango wrote: (Post 7180483)
But in the end, how is he really different from the legal system? It finds its evil-doers, it judges them based on their own codes of conduct, and then if deemed unreedemable, they are executed and disposed of.

The inherent barbarism of the death penalty aside, Dexter is different for at least one important reason: he's only one man. In the legal system, a criminal that's to be executed is first given due process, with all the rights accorded to any criminal defendant. There's a trial, legal representation, the whole ball of wax. Dexter doesn't do any of that. It's simply one man deciding who lives and who dies.

Of course the legal/judicial system makes mistakes as well. There have been innocent people convicted and even executed. But that doesn't make Dexter's actions any more justifiable. At least in the system, there are numerous checks and balances put in place to at least TRY to minimize the possibility that innocent people will be executed. Dexter, on the other hand, may claim that he is good, but in the end he is still killing pretty much whoever he wants to. I don't see how that's more laudable than the legal system. It's chaos and disorder.

ToddKent October 31 2012 11:15 PM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
In the later seasons they seem to have headed toward what Mister Fandago is describing. But I really preferred the earlier take on Dexter in that his choice of victims was not based on any moral judgement whatsoever but solely because they fit within the guidelines of his code. He didn't kill people because they were bad and needed to be punished. He killed people because he got off on it.

He had that code beaten into his head so much by his father that he never strayed from it. The code made it more difficult for him to be caught (as opposed to just killing random people on the street which would have gotten him caught quicker) and therefore allowed him to continue to kill. He enjoys killing so he stuck to the code.

But after a while they needed to develop the character so they got away from that and he started to become more like what MF describes. Which is probably for the best but I always thought it was an interesting idea to have an evil, murdering psychopath as a protagonist who just happened to arbitrarily take on the role of a more traditional protagonist.

Mister Fandango November 1 2012 12:57 AM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
When it comes down to it, he's sort of a modern take on the goddess Nemesis.

Sci November 1 2012 02:27 AM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
There's nothing good or moral about a serial killer. What Dexter does is murder, pure and simple.

Mr. Laser Beam November 1 2012 03:09 AM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
Perhaps the last victim of Dexter will be himself. Let's say he DOES make a mistake and kills an innocent person. By his own logic, then, he must die. But would that make Dexter the M-5, then? :D

Trekker4747 November 1 2012 03:16 AM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
Quote:

Mr. Laser Beam wrote: (Post 7185862)
Perhaps the last victim of Dexter will be himself. Let's say he DOES make a mistake and kills an innocent person. By his own logic, then, he must die. But would that make Dexter the M-5, then? :D

I was following the M-5 logic there too before you mentioned it. You could argue he'll M-5 himself even WITHOUT the mistake by realizing that by killing people -even bad ones- that makes him bad too.

Guy Gardener November 1 2012 04:46 AM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
He killed Jimmy Smits brother by accident, and killed some hillbilly on the road at one point in a public toilet... Not exactly the innocent, but he didn't live up to the code either.

SimpleLogic November 1 2012 05:22 AM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
Quote:

Guy Gardener wrote: (Post 7186177)
He killed Jimmy Smits brother by accident, and killed some hillbilly on the road at one point in a public toilet... Not exactly the innocent, but he didn't live up to the code either.

He also killed the photographer when it was his assistant who murdered the girls. That one he totally messed up.

Guy Gardener November 1 2012 05:50 AM

Re: Dexter and what he does.
 
That was a righteous kill, it was the code that failed Dexter, not Dexter who failed the code.


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 04:01 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.