The Trek BBS

The Trek BBS (http://www.trekbbs.com/index.php)
-   Star Trek Movies XI+ (http://www.trekbbs.com/forumdisplay.php?f=50)
-   -   How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe? (http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=188416)

los2188 September 17 2012 03:40 AM

How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Sadly, I never did see Trek 09 when it was in the movie theaters, but I've always had on question about the movie. How did Nero and his crew escape the prison planet Rura Penthe, and then get back aboard his ship the Narada?

R. Star September 17 2012 03:46 AM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Another convienent plot device that doesn't stand up to scutiny.

los2188 September 17 2012 03:58 AM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Quote:

R. Star wrote: (Post 6972418)
Another convienent plot device that doesn't stand up to scutiny.

So it was never explained???

M'Sharak September 17 2012 04:14 AM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Quote:

los2188 wrote: (Post 6972400)
Sadly, I never did see Trek 09 when it was in the movie theaters, but I've always had on question about the movie. How did Nero and his crew escape the prison planet Rura Penthe, and then get back aboard his ship the Narada?

In fact, the movie covers neither Nero & Co.'s imprisonment nor their escape from (never-identified) prison planet. Such scenes of capture, prison, interrogation and escape as were filmed do not appear in the finished film. (A tiny exception: there is one very brief shot of Nero's face which appears in the mind-meld sequence which I believe was taken from film shot for the interrogation scene, but OldSpock's meld narration says nothing about it.)


Quote:

R. Star wrote: (Post 6972418)
Another convienent plot device that doesn't stand up to scutiny.

Well, no. In the movie as released, the Klingon thread doesn't exist, and what does not exist cannot be scrutinized (because that would be an examination of nothing.)


Quote:

los2188 wrote: (Post 6972463)

So it was never explained???

Never explained, correct.

Cookies and Cake September 17 2012 04:18 AM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Since it was all deleted, the whole Rura Penthe subplot involving the capture of Nero is non-canonical. From the point of view of canon, it never happened, and so Nero and his crew never escaped, because they never spent any time on the prison planet in the first place.

Set Harth September 17 2012 04:29 AM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Quote:

M'Sharak wrote: (Post 6972553)
(A tiny exception: there is one very brief shot of Nero's face which appears in the mind-meld sequence which I believe was taken from film shot for the interrogation scene, but OldSpock's meld narration says nothing about it.)

I could be wrong, but I thought the shot of Nero during the mind meld showed him out in the open on the prison planet ( in the "yard", so to speak ) and the shot taken from the interrogation scene was used in a different part of the film, when Nero is on the Narada and about to be approached by Ayel.

Quote:

M'Sharak wrote: (Post 6972553)
In the movie as released, the Klingon thread doesn't exist, and what does not exist cannot be scrutinized (because that would be an examination of nothing ).

There are remnants of the Klingon thread in the released film: the dialogue to the effect that the Kelvin incident took place near the edge of Klingon space, the reference to the distress call from the Klingon prison planet, assumed to be the Narada's handiwork, the aforementioned mind meld shot, and in Nero's closeup we can see that one of his ears has been damaged.

Quote:

CorporalCaptain wrote:
Since it was all deleted, the whole Rura Penthe subplot involving the capture of Nero is non-canonical. From the point of view of canon, it never happened

But it still could have happened. The final film does not confirm it, but also does not preclude it from having happened.

M'Sharak September 17 2012 05:52 AM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Quote:

Set Harth wrote: (Post 6972598)
Quote:

M'Sharak wrote: (Post 6972553)
(A tiny exception: there is one very brief shot of Nero's face which appears in the mind-meld sequence which I believe was taken from film shot for the interrogation scene, but OldSpock's meld narration says nothing about it.)

I could be wrong, but I thought the shot of Nero during the mind meld showed him out in the open on the prison planet ( in the "yard", so to speak ) and the shot taken from the interrogation scene was used in a different part of the film, when Nero is on the Narada and about to be approached by Ayel.

You know, I believe you're right. I was misremembering the placements.

Quote:

Set Harth wrote: (Post 6972598)
Quote:

M'Sharak wrote: (Post 6972553)
In the movie as released, the Klingon thread doesn't exist, and what does not exist cannot be scrutinized (because that would be an examination of nothing ).

There are remnants of the Klingon thread in the released film: the dialogue to the effect that the Kelvin incident took place near the edge of Klingon space, the reference to the distress call from the Klingon prison planet, assumed to be the Narada's handiwork, the aforementioned mind meld shot, and in Nero's closeup we can see that one of his ears has been damaged.

Quote:

CorporalCaptain wrote:
Since it was all deleted, the whole Rura Penthe subplot involving the capture of Nero is non-canonical. From the point of view of canon, it never happened

But it still could have happened. The final film does not confirm it, but also does not preclude it from having happened.

There's room for a certain amount of conjecture, sure, but there's just not enough material remaining from the deleted scenes to form the basis for anything more than speculation.

Cookies and Cake September 17 2012 05:59 AM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Quote:

Set Harth wrote: (Post 6972598)
Quote:

CorporalCaptain wrote:
Since it was all deleted, the whole Rura Penthe subplot involving the capture of Nero is non-canonical. From the point of view of canon, it never happened

But it still could have happened. The final film does not confirm it, but also does not preclude it from having happened.

True.

Quote:

M'Sharak wrote: (Post 6972871)
There's room for a certain amount of conjecture, sure, but there's just not enough material remaining from the deleted scenes to form the basis for anything more than speculation.

Also true.

There's nothing in the film—at least that I'm aware of—that necessitates its occurrence.

F. King Daniel September 17 2012 09:19 AM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Quote:

R. Star wrote: (Post 6972418)
Another convienent plot device that doesn't stand up to scutiny.

An incomplete deleted scene (there's more in the script that was likely filmed and is probably being held onto for a special edition) that has no bearing on the finished movie anyway. Certainly not a plot device.

SalvorHardin September 17 2012 01:25 PM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
I think the movie part of this equation has been covered by the posts above.

If the comics were to be consulted on the matter, Nero was held in prison while the Klingons had his ship in orbital quarantine trying to analyse it and unlock its technology. Which they couldn't do, since it was too advanced for them with all the Borg tech and whatnot. They couldn't get it online and when they tried to take it apart it would repair itself.
Meanwhile, Nero builds a fearsome prison reputation, makes about 60 escape attempts and tries through the years to calculate when Spock's wormhole would open.
At some point the Narada goes online by itself and starts firing of Rura Penthe. Nero takes advantage of that and escapes to the ship which is now out of his control and goes to warp on its own to go find V'Ger.

Therin of Andor September 17 2012 02:45 PM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Quote:

M'Sharak wrote: (Post 6972871)
There's room for a certain amount of conjecture, sure, but there's just not enough material remaining from the deleted scenes to form the basis for anything more than speculation.

http://www.startrekcomics.info/idwnero.html

"From Star Trek writer/producers Roberto Orci and Alex Kurtzman and the creative team behind the prequel comic 'Star Trek: Countdown' (Writers: Mike Johnson, Tim Jones, Artist: David Messina) comes an all-new story set within the events of the film! Not an adaptation, this exclusive story follows the villainous Nero as he seeks to destroy the Federation. An essential chapter in the rebirth of 'Star Trek'!"

Cookies and Cake September 17 2012 02:52 PM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Quote:

Therin of Andor wrote: (Post 6973903)
Quote:

M'Sharak wrote: (Post 6972871)
There's room for a certain amount of conjecture, sure, but there's just not enough material remaining from the deleted scenes to form the basis for anything more than speculation.

http://www.startrekcomics.info/idwnero.html

"From Star Trek writer/producers Roberto Orci and Alex Kurtzman and the creative team behind the prequel comic 'Star Trek: Countdown' (Writers: Mike Johnson, Tim Jones, Artist: David Messina) comes an all-new story set within the events of the film! Not an adaptation, this exclusive story follows the villainous Nero as he seeks to destroy the Federation. An essential chapter in the rebirth of 'Star Trek'!"

So what's your point?

Therin of Andor September 17 2012 03:09 PM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Quote:

CorporalCaptain wrote: (Post 6973933)
So what's your point?

Several, I guess. I thought people might appreciate a link that gave all the synopses and credits to the "Nero" issues, and the wording of the promo text.

And that Orci & Kurtzman themselves suggested the (non canonical) plot, so it's a little more than general fan "speculation". It's creator speculation.

Sorry to darken your day.

Cookies and Cake September 17 2012 04:25 PM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Quote:

Therin of Andor wrote: (Post 6973996)
Quote:

CorporalCaptain wrote: (Post 6973933)
So what's your point?

Several, I guess. I thought people might appreciate a link that gave all the synopses and credits to the "Nero" issues, and the wording of the promo text.

And that Orci & Kurtzman themselves suggested the (non canonical) plot, so it's a little more than general fan "speculation". It's creator speculation.

Sorry to darken your day.

Oh, I wouldn't say you darkened my day at all. I just didn't feel like solving a riddle.

R. Star September 17 2012 04:36 PM

Re: How did the Nero, his crew and ship escape Rura Penthe?
 
Quote:

KingDaniel wrote: (Post 6973258)
Quote:

R. Star wrote: (Post 6972418)
Another convienent plot device that doesn't stand up to scutiny.

An incomplete deleted scene (there's more in the script that was likely filmed and is probably being held onto for a special edition) that has no bearing on the finished movie anyway. Certainly not a plot device.

My apologies, I gave the writers too much credit then. An incomplete plot device regarding a capture in a prison makes more sense than Nero just.... staring at the walls for 20 years as the movie presents.


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 11:35 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
FireFox 2+ or Internet Explorer 7+ highly recommended.