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-   -   Batman: 1 parent instead of 2 (http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=122435)

Joe Washington May 31 2010 08:44 PM

Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
Would Bruce Wayne still become Batman if one of his parents had die that night they were held at gunpoint by a mugger instead of both of them ?

Nerys Myk May 31 2010 09:06 PM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
If thats the way it was written, then sure.

Ethros May 31 2010 09:11 PM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
If he had time to prepare, then yes

Anwar May 31 2010 09:13 PM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
Well, he might be a bit better socially adjusted as an adult and not as messed up as he is since he'd have a parent whom WOULD be willing to stand up to him and lay down the law.

Christopher May 31 2010 10:23 PM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
In Alan Brennert's classic story "To Kill a Legend," the Phantom Stranger takes Batman to a parallel Earth that's 20 years behind his own and gives him a chance to prevent the murder of that world's Thomas and Martha Wayne. In the end, he succeeds in saving the Waynes, but young Bruce is inspired by the vision of the bat-winged hero who saved his parents to pursue a heroic path of his own. "And when he does, it will not be a decision born of grief, or guilt, or vengeance... but of awe... and mystery... and gratitude." So even without the tragedy, he still becomes Batman, but a more upbeat Batman.

Broccoli May 31 2010 11:26 PM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
Quote:

Christopher wrote: (Post 4126852)
In Alan Brennert's classic story "To Kill a Legend," the Phantom Stranger takes Batman to a parallel Earth that's 20 years behind his own and gives him a chance to prevent the murder of that world's Thomas and Martha Wayne. In the end, he succeeds in saving the Waynes, but young Bruce is inspired by the vision of the bat-winged hero who saved his parents to pursue a heroic path of his own. "And when he does, it will not be a decision born of grief, or guilt, or vengeance... but of awe... and mystery... and gratitude." So even without the tragedy, he still becomes Batman, but a more upbeat Batman.

So, in other words, as Ethros suggested, he had time to prepare...

Nick Ryder June 1 2010 03:34 AM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
LOL yep.

Although what I suppose could have happened, would have been maybe a more Spider-Man like thing. Depends on which parent. If it was his mother, then maybe he'd have been egged on by his dad to "avenge your mother". If it was his father, its possible he may still have gone the route to become Batman, but would have his mother to sort of steer him right. With Alfred as his father figure he'd have a sorta normal life... but I could see him either being slightly more of a momma's boy... or more bitter if/when she started dating again and maybe remarried and went on his world tour to get the hell away.

I almost could have seen... had it been just his mother dying... Thomas Wayne becoming a vigilante first then Bruce getting into the act later.

Now one concept I had a few years ago, basically had both parents dying not because of a simple, random mugging, but because Thomas Wayne and Martha were both sort of "socialite vigilantes". And they weren't just mugged in a "gimme the wallet and the jewels." they had a full on brawl and died protecting Bruce. Which later lead Bruce to sort of learn what his folks did and want to continue their mission to keep Gotham cleaner. And most of the gear he had was actually based on things they used and the parents utilized the cave before Bruce ever did.

I think I was thinking of that idea around the time they were rebooting the DCU for the umpteenth time and thought 'well that'd be kinda cool'

Nerys Myk June 1 2010 03:42 AM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
The path doesn't really matter. The character will always become Batman.

EyalM June 1 2010 11:55 AM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
With both parents dead, Bruce had nothing to lose by going out and fighting criminals in potentially fatal confrontations. But if he had a widowed mother back home, I'd like to think he'd at least think twice about putting his life on the line like that.
And naturally, having a parental figure around would obviously results in a different adult Bruce Wayne.

Christopher June 1 2010 01:52 PM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
Bruce did have a parental figure: Alfred. And Leslie Thompkins, in some continuities. It's not like he grew up as a feral urchin on the streets. He had a good, sheltered upbringing, a life of prosperity that enabled him to get a thorough and eclectic education and obtain the skills and resources he needed to apply himself to any calling he chose. And the calling he chose was crimefighting, the effort to get the predators off the streets and prevent other children from having to suffer as he did.

I've never been crazy about the post-'80s idea of Batman as some borderline psychopath acting out an elaborate revenge fantasy. That just doesn't add up for me. Even in the wake of tragedy, someone raised in such a nurturing and prosperous environment would probably turn out to be pretty well-adjusted, for the most part. Sure, it would take a certain obsessiveness to become Batman, but no worse than the kind of obsessiveness that makes Reed Richards a great scientist or Lois Lane a great reporter.

When I was looking through "To Kill a Legend" yesterday, I came across a couple of panels where Bruce thought, "I guess I'm lucky, in a way. Whenever it gets too painful being Bruce Wayne -- I can always become the Batman! I wonder how normal people manage to cope?" I found that refreshingly different from the later perception of his Batman role as something intrinsically unhealthy, as a failure to cope and grow up and move on. The pre-Crisis, pre-Miller Batman had moved on, had gotten past his parents' death, but still kept on being Batman in order to protect all of Gotham.

byron lomax June 1 2010 02:20 PM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
Quote:

I've never been crazy about the post-'80s idea of Batman as some borderline psychopath acting out an elaborate revenge fantasy. That just doesn't add up for me. Even in the wake of tragedy, someone raised in such a nurturing and prosperous environment would probably turn out to be pretty well-adjusted, for the most part. Sure, it would take a certain obsessiveness to become Batman, but no worse than the kind of obsessiveness that makes Reed Richards a great scientist or Lois Lane a great reporter.
I agree, although I don't think the "borderline psychopath" really came to prominance until the mid-90s or so, especially after Knightfall. Batman definitely did become darker post-Miller, but under the pen of writers such as Alan Grant, Jim Starlin, Peter Milligan and other late 80s/early 90s batscribes, he essentially retained his humanity. But gradually, Miller's bitter aged Batman became the standard characterisation (although I do think that's lightened a bit in the last few years).

barnaclelapse June 1 2010 02:23 PM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
Quote:

Christopher wrote: (Post 4126852)
In Alan Brennert's classic story "To Kill a Legend," the Phantom Stranger takes Batman to a parallel Earth that's 20 years behind his own and gives him a chance to prevent the murder of that world's Thomas and Martha Wayne. In the end, he succeeds in saving the Waynes, but young Bruce is inspired by the vision of the bat-winged hero who saved his parents to pursue a heroic path of his own. "And when he does, it will not be a decision born of grief, or guilt, or vengeance... but of awe... and mystery... and gratitude." So even without the tragedy, he still becomes Batman, but a more upbeat Batman.

Well fuck that...:rommie:

Ensign_Redshirt June 1 2010 04:36 PM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
Quote:

barnaclelapse wrote: (Post 4128378)
Quote:

Christopher wrote: (Post 4126852)
In Alan Brennert's classic story "To Kill a Legend," the Phantom Stranger takes Batman to a parallel Earth that's 20 years behind his own and gives him a chance to prevent the murder of that world's Thomas and Martha Wayne. In the end, he succeeds in saving the Waynes, but young Bruce is inspired by the vision of the bat-winged hero who saved his parents to pursue a heroic path of his own. "And when he does, it will not be a decision born of grief, or guilt, or vengeance... but of awe... and mystery... and gratitude." So even without the tragedy, he still becomes Batman, but a more upbeat Batman.

Well fuck that...:rommie:

A more upbeat Batman? You mean like in the 60s TV show? ;)

Janus VI June 1 2010 05:03 PM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
Quote:

Christopher wrote: (Post 4128313)
Bruce did have a parental figure: Alfred. And Leslie Thompkins, in some continuities.

And of course Aunt Harriet too. :p

[EDIT]
oh wait off day today for me that was actually Dick's aunt whoops lol

Christopher June 1 2010 08:36 PM

Re: Batman: 1 parent instead of 2
 
Quote:

byron lomax wrote: (Post 4128367)
But gradually, Miller's bitter aged Batman became the standard characterisation (although I do think that's lightened a bit in the last few years).

Yeah, I've gathered that Batman's been going in that direction lately, or at least that some (Morrison?) have tried to take him in that direction.


Quote:

Ensign_Redshirt wrote: (Post 4128602)
A more upbeat Batman? You mean like in the 60s TV show? ;)

That's one extreme, the Milleresque psycho is the other extreme. Batman has more generally existed in the middle ground between those.


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