Tom & B'Elana

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Voyager' started by 2takesfrakes, Aug 24, 2016.

  1. LJones41

    LJones41 Commodore Commodore

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    "Blood Fever" is one of my favorite "Voyager" episodes ever. Come to think of it, it's one of my top five favorite Trek episodes of all time. I found it fascinating. As for the Paris/Torres ship, it's my favorite one from the Trek franchise. There were times when it threatened to slip - especially during mid-Season Six - but it was one of the reasons why I enjoyed "Voyager" so much. And for me, it was a masterpiece in storytelling, in compare to how the other romantic relationships were portrayed in the franchise.
     
  2. 2takesfrakes

    2takesfrakes Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Tom & B'Elanna were sweet, yes. I forget who it was, right now, maybe stardream that commented on how Tom would be given such shit, because he would - on occasion - allow himself to get caught up in something that did not involve the woman he loves. It would even take time with him away from her and B'Elanna didn't appreciate that, her heart would get busted. And YET ...

    B'Elanna would always get involved in some crazy horseshit that risked her Life, at least as often as he'd wander off, and that's just supposed to be alright, for some reason. I suppose Tom would've been accused of being misogynistic, or some shit, if he'd gotten in the way of Torres Living a Life of Danger. Hollywood always does this crap and there's no rhyme or reason to it, outside of giving the appearance of being "progressive," some way. What rubbish ...
     
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  3. Tracy Trek

    Tracy Trek Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    ^This. It's a double standard, that's for sure.
     
  4. KelisThePoet

    KelisThePoet Commander Red Shirt

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    On the subject of Ponn Farr and discretion . . .

    Enterprise may have altered things, but from watching the original Star Trek and original cast movies, I get the sense that Starfleet didn't have much experience with Vulcans up to the 23rd century. The very fact that there seem to be so many more of them serving in Starfleet in the 24th century (and integrated among predominantly non-Vulcan crews) might have necessitated a shift in how many non-Vulcans were aware of Ponn Farr and how secretive the Vulcans could be about it.
     
  5. JeffinOakland

    JeffinOakland Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    They're an awkward couple. He's a doughy manchild. She's angry and mean spirited.
     
  6. Catarina

    Catarina Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yet she runs everyone into her ready room when SHE wants to be discreet. Just saying. And yup, she knows him well which was what I was about to tell Stardream that she'd probably figure it out because of how long they've been friends.
     
  7. LJones41

    LJones41 Commodore Commodore

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    Are you referring to B'Elanna's depression, in which Tom was unable to help her with? Or the horseshit that Tom got involved with on his own?

    Then again, I keep forgetting that we're speaking about a couple from "VOYAGER", a show that most Trek fans regard as the nadir of the franchise, due to being led by an actress. And I also forgot that Trek romances are supposed to be between two people who are "ideal".
     
  8. stardream

    stardream Commodore Commodore

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    B'Elanna hurting herself on the holodeck, B'Elanna refusing to let herself be treated by a Hologram, B'Elanna allowing herself to be flatlined....

    Now I can give her a bit of a break in Extreme Risk (that episode is so frustrating rant rant) because of depression but she makes these other life and death decisions without seeming to care what Tom thinks...the person she is supposed to love. He, on the other hand, has his flaws but at least he isn't constantly trying to kill himself yet he seems to get more grief for his decisions that she does.
     
  9. 2takesfrakes

    2takesfrakes Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    LJones41, allow stardream's above description to clarify my own post for you. But there was something else you said that caught my fancy ... that struck my interest ... what was it???

    I am, by no means, a feminist (as Téa's so fond of observing) but you have my assurances that does not mean that I am Hitler! It's just to say it's not my Pet Cause. VOYAGER being Kate Mulgrew's show had no baring on my enjoyment of the programme. I know that STAR TREK gives a lot of lip service to Special Interest ... take the good with the bad, as with everything else, you know?

    I also happen to like Kate. I believe her to be thoroughly professional and totally dedicated to the job of being an actress - which I value much more than a star saying that they're a 'fan' of the franchise. And I liked Janeway. What can I say on that more than that you've already come across, or thought, yourself?

    As for the romances in STAR TREK, I suppose I like that aspect of it to mirror reality, in some way. For example: beautiful people getting with beautiful people, just as happens in Reality. That's why I hate Kes being with Neelix. She's not supposed to hate herself ... you know? Let her have someone handsome.

    I don't mind drama in a relationship, as long as absurd license isn't taken. For example, I can't see Janeway having a Gorn for a boyfriend. It's one thing to date a Kazon, which is enough to get anyone squicked, but it's quite another to make it with something non-Humanoid, like a Mugato. The differences between the pair have to make sense - as with Seska & Chakotay.
     
  10. Thomas Eugene

    Thomas Eugene Commodore Commodore

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    In real life, I know a lot of couples where this is NOT the case.
     
  11. 2takesfrakes

    2takesfrakes Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    ― Understood & Confirmed!
     
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  12. stardream

    stardream Commodore Commodore

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    My husband is better looking than me. I got lucky.
     
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  13. Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME

    Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Just a question: How many children will they have? Of course, there is Miral, who was born at the end of Endgame but it looks like that she will be their only child, while I thought that they will try to have another one, later ...
     
  14. Sophie74656

    Sophie74656 Commodore Commodore

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    In the books they have a son also
     
  15. Sophie74656

    Sophie74656 Commodore Commodore

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    I don't understand why being with Neelix means she hates herself. Asside from a bit of jealousy, he is a very kind and caring man.
     
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  16. 2takesfrakes

    2takesfrakes Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Neelix might be kind and caring, but he is also an aging hyæna! Imagine Kes trying to bring Neelix home, to meet the parents. Her father would probably try to kill Neelix with his bare hands, he'd go so crazy!!!
     
  17. Sophie74656

    Sophie74656 Commodore Commodore

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    Why?
     
  18. Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME

    Ghislaine H. B. BRAEME Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Oh. But were these authors linked to the series? If they wrote their own version of the story, we can't take it for granted, right (idem for all ST webseries)?

    Anyway, thank you for the info, Sophie7456! :)
     
  19. 2takesfrakes

    2takesfrakes Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    To answer you, Sophie ... it's because it's an unequal relationship, that's all. As a father, he'd simply see Neelix as using his daughter. Kes would protest and try to 'defend' him, of course, but that's just her seeking absolution, take that out of the equation. Her father would not approve, that's it and all about it.
     
  20. Sophie74656

    Sophie74656 Commodore Commodore

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    Sorry I'm not getting it. How is Neelix using her?