For those joining us on this journey, welcome! This is a rewatch thread for Star Trek: Deep Space Nine. We'll be watching each episode consecutively on the anniversary of the month/day it aired, then chatting about each episode in this thread. Try to keep the conversation to the episode being rewatched (no big deal if we stray from that rule). We'll have at least a week between episodes for discussion. Here is the schedule for season 1 for your reference: January 3 - Episode 1 (&2), Season 1 "Emissary" January 10 - Episode 3, Season 1 "Past Prologue" January 17 - Episode 4, Season 1 "A Man Alone" January 24 - Episode 5, Season 1 "Babel" January 31 - Episode 6, Season 1 "Captive Pursuit" February 7 - Episode 7, Season 1 "Q-Less" February 14 - Episode 8, Season 1 "Dax" February 21 - Episode 9, Season 1 "The Passenger" March 14 - Episode 10, Season 1 "Move Along Home" March 21 - Episode 11, Season 1 "The Nagus" April 18 - Episode 12, Season 1 "Vortex" April 25 - Episode 13, Season 1 "Battle Lines" May 2 - Episode 14, Season 1 "The Storyteller" May 9 - Episode 15, Season 1 "Progress" May 16 - Episode 16, Season 1 "If Wishers Were Horses" May 23 - Episode 17, Season 1 "The Forsaken" May 30 - Episode 18, Season 1 "Dramatis Personae" June 13 - Episode 19, Season 1 "Duet" June 20 - Episode 20, Season 1 "In the Hands of the Prophets" First up: Episode 1 (&2), Season 1 "Emissary" Rewatch date: January 3, 2015 Original television promos (thanks to TrekCore for sharing on youtube) [yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwGshJTP9Us[/yt] [yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgLk8zN_p7Q[/yt] Watch or rewatch "Emissary" on January 3 or sometime over the next week, then join the discussion!
Just started my rewatch, but had to pause to put the baby down for a nap. Here are my initial thoughts: I thought the opening sequence (Wolf 359) was powerful and really set us up for a very different commanding officer and a very different show (potentially). I didn't care for the technobabble throughout the scene. But I thought Avery Brooks did a great job here. This episode, while good, contains IMO some of the most awkward acting and interacting in the series. But that seems to be true for most pilot episodes. The characters haven't been fully developed. The actors (and writers) don't fully understand where the characters and the series will be going yet. Chemistry hasn't been found or developed in many cases. Sisko's strongest scenes seem to be the scenes with Jake. You can tell that Avery really cares about and connects with those moments in the script. They're totally believable and touching. I love Kira. She's probably my favorite character in the series. But her opening scene is at times cringeworthy. Too dramatic. Overacting (still not nearly to the degree of Denise Crosby's overacting in the TNG pilot). But it's also the writing. They're establishing her current emotional state as a character, background on how Bajor feels about the Federation being there, background on the fight for independence, the Cardassians as their oppressors, etc., so it's understandable why the scene is there. Hindsight, I think the scene could have been shortened a lot. With the scene between Picard and Sisko, it's easy to see why some hardcore TNG fans would be turned off straight away. Picard is somewhat seen as the bad guy. Sisko is unforgiving and pissed, even though Picard wasn't in control of his mind or body at the time. But I admit, I love this scene. I actually re-edited it with the Wolf 359 scenes as flashbacks during their conversation, and to me that worked really well. I love both of these characters and I can feel their emotions in the scene. The scene in Odo's office is great! Odo and Quark hit the ground running with their love-to-hate relationship. The chemistry is the same here as it is in their final scene on the series. Perfect actors for their roles from the very beginning. Superb. I adore Opaka. I wish they brought her back more often than they did as part of dreams/visions. There's just something about her that worked extremely well for me. I believed that she truly believed. She was genuine. I think the orbs were underused in the series. I might as well also say here that I loved the Bajor religion and any episode or scene dealing with it. I understand if people buy into the idea that humanity evolves beyond religion in the future. But Bajor is another planet entirely. Can't other species have religion? And if their religion was formed based on what seemed to be supernatural to them (the wormhole and the wormhole aliens), isn't that pretty awesome? I find it totally fascinating. I think some people just hate religion in general and they think Star Trek should only show religion in a negative light if they're going to go there. I'm glad this show didn't take that approach even if others disagree. The beach flashback was terrible. The acting was awful on the part of both actors, but especially the actress who played Jennifer. I thought she did well in later episodes, but this scene just felt like a bad high school play. When they started walking on the beach it got better. But I really wish they chose a memory that had more emotion and less...cheese. So that's where I am right now. Hope to finish the episode today though!
^ Some really good observations! I finished watching the pilot a few hours ago myself, but I'm not sure if I'll be able to put my thoughts into words quite as eloquently. So I'll just do some sort of list of things I found noteworthy: RANDOM OBSERVATIONS I don't know what it is about that text crawl at the beginning, but I love it! I have the same reaction to the text crawl at the beginning of Voyager. I just love the fact that it sets the story in a bigger universe the audience already knows about. Am I the only one who wishes they could have spent more money on the bridge set of the Saratoga? It's a minor things that doesn't really bother me, but it's really noticeable. They seem to try to cover up the tiny sets by relying almost entirely on close-ups. That has got to be the only thing I don't like about that opening sequence. I loved seeing Jake and Benjamin Sisko fishing on the holodeck. I wonder if they ever planned to bring that program back to the series. Boy, that title sequence is still so unbelievably beautiful to my eyes! The visuals and the music are so majestic and awesome that, however long I haven't watched an episode, I feel right at home when we get our first glimpse of the station. This chain of associations (first note of Dennis McCarthy's theme → an hour of quality entertainment ahead of me) is so ingrained in my subconscious at this point! Why is it important that Nog isn't Quark's own son? I'm unclear why they had to make a point of him being Quark's brother's boy. Also, where exactly in the episode do we see Rom? That matte painting/model of Bajor is just stunning! Does anyone have an unprocessed picture of it? How big was this thing anyway? What I like about the orbs is how Michael Piller uses them in the script to show (rather than tell) us some of the backstory of the characters in a natural way. It's presented somewhat inconsistently, however: When Sisko has his vision of meeting Jennifer for the first time, it ends when Kai Opaka closes the ark of the orb. Later, when Jadzia has her vision about her joining, it seems to end all on its own, right at the moment when that sequence ends anyway. Looking at how much Sisko enjoyed being able to relieve that moment again, I wonder if there wasn't a missed story opportunity in there. It would only come naturally, that someone like Sisko could become addicted to the orb. I think that could have become an interesting theme for an episode later on. What's ultimatively the business of Sisko and Dax seeing different surroundings once they land inside the wormhole? I don't remember that they ever mentioned this later on. I'm not sure if I understand why the Cardassians leave the station only to come back a few days later trying to seize it. Am I missing something? That whole McCarthy score is wonderful! Maybe it's because I listened to it so much without watching the actual episode alongside it, but some of the cues are just marvelous. The music when we see the Saratoga explode or when Ben and Jake first see the station is incredible! Visually that whole pilot is just gorgeous. There's so much I would love to feast my eyes on in pristine high-definition quality. Oh, well ... THINGS I NOTICED FOR THE FIRST TIME That's the first time I noticed that O'Brien's uniform actually has a big white smear all over it when we first meet him. When we first meet Kira she calls the station a “god-forsaken place” and makes it sound like she was sent there against her will. Isn't that at odds with what we learn about her character later on? Even without the wormhole the station seems to be one of the most important places for anyone who wants to help rebuild Bajor. So where the hell would she want to be? I know that Picard is accustomed to calling the Bajorans “Bajora”, but why is he the only one in this episode who keeps pronouncing the planet “Bah-jor” instead of “Bay-jor”, how everyone else is saying it? That's the first time that I noticed that the alien in Quark's bar is actually playing his instrument with cucumbers! So that's why that cue is named “Cucumbers in Space”! They mention that the Cardassians are in possession of the eight other orbs and that the Bajorans only own one. Isn't that at odd with what we learn later in the series? Why do the Cardassians who won all that gold-pressed latinum don't bring it into their quarters once they're on their ship? Instead they dump it in some chamber in the hallway? That's the first time I noticed that almost all inserts of monitor readouts in the pilot are done with actual CRT monitors instead of special effects. Was that a conscious decision? FAVORITE MOMENTS That scene with Bashir and Kira in sickbay is just brilliant. It's nicely written, fits the characters perfectly at this point and is blocked really clever. I love that moment when O'Brien has to kick that console to beam Odo from the Cardassian ship. That moment when we first see the wormhole and that whole sequence of Sisko talking to the wormhole beings is just compelling science fiction television. The concept of a non-linear existence is fascinating, albeit one that's really hard to grasp. Those scenes with Sisko in the wormhole are easily my favorite from the pilot. It's a shame though, that they are intercut with this whole business with the three Cardassian ships threatening the station. I wish I could remember what my feelings were when I first watched this episode years ago as a child. I imagine I was quite amazed by all the new characters and spaceships. It's also hard to image what my feelings were if I had seen this for the first time just now. It's impossible for me to separate my feelings of nostalgia and the love I have for the series as a whole from something like an objective evaluation of the merits of “Emissary”. I just know that I love that pilot. And that no matter when – the time when I was a child who was easily impressed by “space shows” or now when I put higher requirements on a new television series – I would definitely tune in a week later to see another episode. Here's another preview clip for the pilot, if anyone is interested. Strangely, it uses music from Star Trek – The Wrath of Khan (?), some scenes from later season one episodes, and a TNG shuttle in place of a runabout. That sounds pretty interesting, to be honest. Can this be watched anywhere? That's so true. Rewatching the series some years ago I was struck at how little she actually is in the series. Camille Saviola just left such a big impression on me that I could have sworn she was in many more episodes than just the four she actually appears in. You and me both then! The Bajorans are one of my favorite parts of the show. They are the reason why I love the first two seasons so much. I have never understood why a majority of fandom despises them so much.
My thoughts: There is a lot in this episode that resembles TMP and Encounter at Farpoint. It is another meeting between humanity and an incorporeal, deified race. Rather than surrendering to abstractions, the script went deep into the meaning of many of the values put forward by those previous stories. Explorations is an encounter with both the other and oneself? What does that mean? We get a deep probing of Sisko's psyche. And those explorations reveal a man who has allowed himself to feel love and loss, to be vulnerable, and to be human in ways that neither Kirk nor Picard did. Kira's hair is flying all over the place. I love how odd it looks in her firs scene, but how perfectly coifed she is in the very next scene. I realized that much of what made the Opaka character so interesting was not her direct interaction with Sisko,but the Prophets' representation of her. I love how they have Brooks switch back and forth between the TNG and DS9 uniforms in the flashbacks. Like I've said in the past, this episode puts Kira and Dax to the fore, confronting the Cardassians in the way Riker and Data might have. Speaking of Dax, Terry Farrell is generally good in this episode. However, she seems very posey when she first arrives at the station, modelling more than acting. I also found her sitrep in OPS to be very stilted. Loved her interaction with Brooks. On the promenade, Kira tells Sisko that he might not like to get his hands dirty. Of course, he picks up debris,throws it in a dumpster, than shows her his hands. It seems that there would be a secondary meaning concerning Brooks' ethnicity. Stewart and Meeney try really hard to chew the scenery in the transporter room: there just isn't much there. Was the opening Trek's first true multiship combat scene? It seems that the Federation Ships move only in the same plane. All Treks should have had a scene in which the new captain/commander confronts his predecessor like Sisko did with Picard. I loved Jake in this episode, reflecting better than any other character the frustrations of "army life." The launch of the Runabout reminds me of Space 1999. This is a great pilot, focusing more on the personality of the lead character more than the other Trek pilots. We see Sisko as a man who can feel joy and love, but is defeated by his pain. The older I get, the more I understand his weaknesses. How Brooks bawls as he admits " And I have never figured out how to live without her!" Heartbreaking.
A small moment that makes me laugh is at the end of a scene in quarks the soon to be traditional cry of "DABO!!!" goes up followed by a huge groan from the crowd instead of the more usual cheer we're used to from later eps. I know it's stupid but it really cracks me up whenever I hear it
D'oh! Didn't get a chance to finish it today. But I will at some point over the next couple of days. Certainly by Monday. Here it is. The scene I was referring to is about 6 minutes in: [yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=we9lqkvrL5o[/yt]
I thought the beach scene between Sisko and Jennifer was beautiful and essential to understanding what kind of relationship the two had. It was touching and I understood his pain and why he couldn't let go of her. Sisko letting go his anger and showing true emotion about her was touching and I loved the intercutting of allowing him to teach the wormhole aliens about being linear and human. It was best Star Trek pilot ever made. I love Deep Space Nine when it was written creatively.
Finally finished watching. A few more things I'd like to add: Terry's acting was shaky when they "landed" in the wormhole. That whole scene felt awkward. Also Terry's acting when she came back from the wormhole, describing her experience to the station crew, was pretty bad. To me, Terry improves from here. And because of that, I can forgive the not-so-stellar performance here. [COMMENTARY UNRELATED TO THIS EPISODE] I'm one of the few Jadzia fans around here. Most say the writers could figure out what to do with her. From my perspective, the writers were trying to figure out what to do with all of the characters, but it took longer to land with some. It seems to me when we saw the on-screen meeting between Jadzia and Worf, something clicked with the writers and they figured out who Jadzia was and how to writer her because after that moment she was an absolute firecracker. Loved her. [/IRRELEVANT COMMENTARY ] I loved Miles in this episode. He's awesome and steady throughout the series, but to me he was important in this episode and early in the series. He was the real guy. He made the station and the chaos surrounding it seem real. Sort of the foundation for buying into all of it if that makes any sense at all. I think the writers realized that quickly. I loved Sisko's interaction with the wormhole aliens/prophets. And I wasn't prepared to get emotional during this episode because I haven't before, but this time I did. Twice. Once when the prophets finally understood Sisko and said "you exist here," and he just nodded while tears poured down his face. The second moment was when Sisko saw Jake at the station and they embraced. McCarthy's score put me over the edge there. Wonderful. I found those two moments incredibly emotional and touching on this rewatch, more than ever before. It was chilling to see Odo wondering about his origins. It slipped my mind that this was addressed so early in the series. It's hard not to be charmed by Gul Dukat. It's all thanks to the incredible actor behind the make-up. He's one of those actors who can make anything sound classic just by opening his mouth. Brilliant. And having seen the series through a couple of times now, it's just wonderful to see him in the pilot. I loved the moment between Kira and Quark at the very end. Although I'm a bit confused at him saying he loved a woman in uniform...I thought a clothed woman was a major turn-off to his species? Whatever. I still thought it was a great moment!
Sorry in advance for this long post. Wanted to chime in on some of your awesome points so far! Same here. Would have been great if they kept coming back to it. Then in the final episode, have Jake fishing alone. You said it! It's such a subtle open. The station is in the distance and that great low bass tone comes in. You really feel the loneliness of the station and of space itself, but you also get the grandeur, power and character of this station. And the theme works so well throughout the series. Weird not to see the wormhole at the end of the open though! Rom appeared in a passing shot, can't remember exactly when. He was saying something to a customer in the bar, I believe. I'm not sure why they didn't want Nog to be Quark's son. That's an excellent question for the writers. I don't know, but I would have cut that out or reshot it. It was an interesting idea, but it didn't work with those two actors at that time. I think they left due to the Federation showing their muscles and they returned and continue to return to snoop around for weaknesses and look for opportunities. And to remain relevant. Amen! I think she says that because the station is Cardassian, it has a vile history, and at this point her character was hopelessly and totally racist against the entire population of Cardassia. BUT, I still cringe at that line and especially her delivery. That's something else I fixed in my video edit. I'm pretty sure that scene is used in every fan trailer for the series I've ever seen. I think Kirk and Picard had similar moments eventually, but certainly this was the earliest in any series we were able to get such a deeply personal look at the Commanding character.
Both probably related. Before the wormhole, I imagine serving on the station was like being posted to, say, a U.S. Air Defense station in Alaska during the Cold War: Important, yes, but far from the seat of power and not an assignment most people would actually want. It's suggested that Kira was enough of a thorn in the side to the Provisional Government that they wanted her someplace out of the way. And the change in the Cardassians' attitude is entirely due to the wormhole. When they pulled out, it was after they had basically stripped Bajor of every valuable resource. They didn't just leave due to Federation pressure or Bajoran harassment; while those both may have helped, they also didn't stand to lose very much because there wasn't all that much left for them to take from Bajor. The wormhole immediately caused the value of the real estate to skyrocket.
Well, after posting the video in this thread it was flagged and blocked due to copyright infingement. Ah well. So instead of my entire edit, I posted just the clip I was referring to. Hopefully this won't get blocked: [yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0gaXqJV1hs[/yt] And this is how I think the meeting with Kira could have been cut down without the "you're throwing it all away" conversation which seemed like generic nonsense and without the "god-forsaken place" speech which felt like forced dialogue (plus overacting IMO, YMMV). [yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qE8anymoaIE[/yt]
Almost time for another episode! Episode 3, Season 1 "Past Prologue" Rewatch date: January 10, 2015 Original television promos (thanks to TrekCore for sharing on youtube) [yt]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JDCazdktcc[/yt] Watch or rewatch "Past Prologue" on January 10 or sometime over the next week, then join the discussion!
Maybe to emphasize the fact that he's French. A French person would pronounce it that way. I never bought this non-linear nonsense. For one thing, if they were really truly non-linear then it would be impossible to even talk to them as our language is by its very nature.. linear. Try to move around the words in sentences and even the sentences themselves and see if it stilll makes sense.
That's a really good observation. Say what you will about Sisko's character or Avery Brook's performance, but his Captain surely was the first who was allowed to show some emotion and weakness right from the beginning. Although I guess a lot of it has to do with changing television conventions. In the 90s your main character really didn't have to be an all-out hero. Anti-heros were really en vogue back then. Sorry, but I'm at a loss at what you could mean by this. Is there a particular meaning of someone with brown skin getting his hands dirty? True. I wish Piller would have written something a little more personal. Whenever I watch this scene I keep waiting for O'Brien to at least spit out an “It was an honor serving with you, sir”. But no, nothing. Yeah, me too. He really seemed just like a genuine child who just rolls his eyes at his father's attempt to appease him. That's interesting. I hadn't noticed that. Have to watch out for that scene the next time. Yeah, that whole sequence is particularly strong. The line that gets me the most is Sisko's “I see her like this every time I close my eyes. In the darkness, in the blink of an eye, I see her like this.” Beautiful delivery. Yup, in hindsight they were really lucky that all the little hints they had in the beginning of the series about Odo's origin fit what we learn about it later on. Yup, that's definitely weird. But I think that was a really clever thing to do by the producers. Maybe it was important to them that his character remained a bachelor? I don't know why it would, though. Romantic Quark stories were few and far between. Yeah, I had to jump back to watch that again just to be sure I heard right. How'd you do that? That however doen't fit the chain of events we see in the episode. Dukat arrives before the wormhole is found. And when the three Cardassian ships arrive later on, they still don't seem to believe Kira's talk about a wormhole. So what were they doing there in the first place? Brilliant stuff! That idea of re-cutting existing episode is pretty neat. Gotta try that myself one of these days. I especially like the way it ends with Garak introduction to Bashir. Again, brilliant! You know, I would love if this was the reason for him mispronouncing it. But I think it really is just that nobody noticed or cared how he said it. Another reason why I don't think they did it to emphazise his “Frenchness” is that that preview video for “Past Prologue” dub's been posting above (Thanks!) has another Bajoran saying it like Picard did. Hm, I'm not sure that how these scenes are meant to be read. They don't have actual conversations using words and sentences. I always read it a visual representation of them having an exchange of thought and feelings. Think about it: They keep showing Sisko in the white nothing-ness, suggesting this is where he really is while he “talks” to the Prophets. Then later the dialog suggests that they are able to feel what Sisko is feeling. I plan on watching “Past Prologue” later this day. I will post my thoughts then.
My notes on the "Emissary" rewatch: All the character introductions were well handled. Seeing the way Sisko acts with Jake was an immediate sign that this new captain would have a very different temperament from Picard: warmer, less aloof. O'Brien's sleeves-rolled-up down-to-earth nature is clear from the beginning, as are Kira's temper, Odo's curmudgeonliness, Bashir's enthusiasm and naivete, and Dax's sense of humor. Thinking back to the TNG pilot, a lot of the character introductions in that episode were kind of flat or ham-handed; the DS9 pilot avoided that. I always get kind of bored during wormhole scenes, orb visions, etc., so those scenes make "Emissary" drag for me. But they also allowed a lot of background information to be shown quickly without a bunch of verbal exposition, so in the end it was a good choice. I like the bridge crew of the Saratoga. Of the four people with lines, two are nonhuman, including the captain. That seems a lot more realistic for a Federation starship than a lot of the crews we see. Random nitpick: When Sisko and O'Brien walk through the trashed promenade, something is spewing what looks like coolant. That seems like the kind of problem that would be a lot more dangerous and high-priority than picking up debris. "We'll try to keep the dog off your lawn" always seemed odd to me. The writers probably just intended "We'll be good neighbors," but I keep hearing it with "the dog" as a denigrating reference to the Bajorans -- "the Federation will keep the Bajorans under control." I doubt it was intended that way.
Because it could have been a response to the "white hands" ad, which was still contentious and memorable in 1993.
"A Man Alone" Not my favorite. It's not that there's necessarily anything wrong with it; it just sort of fades into the obscurity of not-very-memorable. However, this and the next episode ("Past Prologue") do serve the purpose of getting a lot of Odo's and Kira's backstories established, which needed to happen. Odo's exposition about his regenerative cycle and sleeping in a bucket seems like it would be better directed toward Sisko. I know Kira hadn't been assigned to DS9 all that long, but it still seems like they know each other reasonably well -- in the next episode she comments that "I've learned to respect your opinion," the kind of thing she'd say to someone she's known more than a few weeks. I'd expect that she'd already know about his regenerative cycle. It's not totally unreasonable, because that might not be something Odo discusses all that casually, but it still threw me a little. There's something very "stagey" about the mob outside Odo's office, as if they're standing on one side of some invisible line.
Or, it could have been Sisko's response to Kira's belief that Sisko thinks he's better than her because he's a captain. Not everything has to be about race, despite what most of America likes to think.